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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 04 2006 : 04:18:29 AM
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Hello & Namaste Yogani & All,
In the "yantra for I am" discussion, I would have posted the (Devanagari) results for everyone to see, but our, er --- "very pre-Web 2.0" forum interface doesn't make it real intuitive to do so.
(And I'm not "dissing" the forum interface Yogani - it's great to have the forum, period -- and an ongoing "thanks and namaste" for creating and hosting it!)
However, if you ever want to upgrade to something a bit more Web 2.0 (where inserting things like graphics, soundfiles, video clips, etc. is really easy, where users can keep up to date on threads by subscribing to them via RSS, etc.) -- please let me know.
I was going to say "drop me a line" - but I decided it would probably be better to do it as a forum thread (hence this post) - I'm probably not the only "tech-ish" AYPer - and certainly don't have a monopoly on good ideas in this realm.
I just don't want to run with the discussion, if you're not interested ...
(Plus, it would be good to know how interested other AYPers are in some of these capabilities -- personally, I would find the RSS subscription feature to be awesome -- I miss a lot of good posts by having to remember to check back manually - and RSS is very non-invasive (and ultra-easy to use) - you just get a little "chiclet" icon on the toolbar in your browser or newsreader -- no emails, or anything like that.)
There may be some truly free options, but for the most part, there are associated costs, but they seems pretty reasonable ($99-$249 set-up / license fee, and $10-$20/mo. for the highest cost options I've seen.)
So ...
Yogani: Please let me / us know if you're interested in discussing.
AYPers: Please let me / us know how much (or "if") you would like to see additional capabilities such as those listed above -- or if you're 100% satisfied "as is" (understanding that it's all Yogani's "call" -- unless he decides to make it a "group thing" --- which is his call, also!  )
Cheers & Namaste,
Kirtanman
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Edited by - Sparkle on Dec 04 2006 04:28:17 AM |
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Wolfgang
Germany
470 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2006 : 07:29:40 AM
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Suggestion for improvement:
I would like to see that users can indicate their sex (male/female) in their profile.
I am often not sure about a users sex 
L&L
Wolfgang |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 04 2006 : 11:32:47 AM
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Hi Kirtanman and Wolfgang:
The Snitz forum software has many more features than we are currently using -- just about everything you mentioned. The options have been kept to a bare minimum in the current setup for simplicity's sake, to save on server storage and bandwidth, and to minimize hacker/spammer/virus invasions (they are always trying to break in, and we have a pretty good system in place now for preventing it).
Maybe other Snitz features will be turned on someday. If you want to see more of what Snitz can do, go to the link at the bottom of this page. It is open source freeware -- not counting hosting and upkeep.
Transforming what we have here to another forum software and database would be a large technical challenge, not to mention an administrative nightmare, so I don't think that is in the cards. Just increasing the options turned on here in Snitz would add considerable upkeep and administration -- not something I can entertain right now. In the digital world, things are seldom as simple as they seem, under the hood that is.
Thanks for the suggestions. Keep the good ideas coming!
The guru is in you.
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Dec 05 2006 : 08:31:21 AM
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| AYP has a myspace page where you can add all of those things. Personally I have problems loading myspace pages because of low bandwidth due to financial restrictions. So this forum as it is, is better for any poor people around the world who can only afford dial-up. Too bad we have to forsake those who don't have a computer and a phone. |
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yoginstar
Netherlands
78 Posts |
Posted - Dec 05 2006 : 3:24:47 PM
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| For what it is worth, the last time I looked up a myspace page linked from this forum I had continuous spam for a while from myspace... sorry about that... |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 01:46:51 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
AYP has a myspace page where you can add all of those things. Personally I have problems loading myspace pages because of low bandwidth due to financial restrictions. So this forum as it is, is better for any poor people around the world who can only afford dial-up. Too bad we have to forsake those who don't have a computer and a phone.
Hi Ether,
I think we're talking about different things.
RSS (Really Simple Syndication) is kinda-sorta like an email subscription - like Yahoo! and Google groups offer - except that you view the content by clicking on a little icon - called a "chiclet" that sits near the top of your browser, on the toolbar.
For an example of what I'm talking about, please visit:
www.taobums.com
... and scroll to the bottom of the screen, and click on the RSS icon (little orange and white thingy).
Voila! To see updates from then on - you just click the Taobums chiclet in your browser toolbar.
To get rid of it, just right-click and delete.
The big difference between RSS and email subscriptions is that RSS does NOT tend to chew up bandwidth, the way email subscriptions do - it's more like having an additional web visitor.
(So the "MySpace Problem" would not be a problem - I have a cable modem - in Silicon Valley they fall between air and food, as in 1. Air 2. Cable Modem 3. Food - regardless of one's financial condition - on the ol' Hierarchy of Needs scale -- and *I* detest MySpace for the same reasons you do -- faster connections do *not* help, vis a vis MySpace!)
Note to Yogani:
To see what's involved in setting up RSS, please check out
http://www.devx.com/xml/Article/10790
Per the growing popularity of RSS, it might be a good way to spread the AYP message -- understanding, of course, that the rate at which you want to "scale" AYP is 100% your call, of course!
As easy or easier would be the addition of fields (i.e. gender) in the profile area - in fact, you could probably get the code to cut-and-paste from the Snitz Forum for their profile form - it includes fields for everything this side of what gum you like to chew on alternate Sundays!
Hope this helps, in one way or another.
Kirtanman
PS - IF you ever decide to check into a more "robust" Forum interface - please check out www.taobums.com - at the bottom of their page is a link to that software package's provider (also open source) - can't recall the name. Just FYI, they offer conversion from one ASP-based package to another, as a service. There is a set-up / license fee ($249 for businesses - for the software, not the transfer - they quote that on a case-by-case basis) -- but what they offer looks pretty slick (Taobums being a decent example) - a proprietary (non-Open Source) vendor would charge several grand - minimum - for what these guys offer for $249. |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 12:01:29 PM
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Hi Kirtanman and All:
I am very interested in any sort of web "viral marketing" programs (RSS and others -- but not spam or unsolicited popups) that could be set up to increase AYP visibility -- preferably the online lessons before the forums, for clarity sake for newcomers.
But I have no time to implement such a thing myself. Any volunteers?
Many thanks!
The guru is in you.
PS -- Having said that, the place to check about an RSS mod for Snitz is with the Snitz folks. It is probably available already. They have every other kind of mod. But remember what I said about AYP forum upgrades in the near term.
But tasteful (non-invasive) technology for spreading the word on AYP far and wide? Oh yes! 
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Athma_Shakti
India
81 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 3:14:09 PM
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Dear Yogani
having vast experience in developing web based sys, i will be happy to offer volunteership to aypsite
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 4:00:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Athma_Shakti
Dear Yogani
having vast experience in developing web based sys, i will be happy to offer volunteership to aypsite
Hi AthmaShakti:
That's great. Thank you. What do you recommend for "viral marketing" that will not eat the webmaster (little me) alive?
The guru is in you. |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 7:13:02 PM
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PS: Just a reminder that we have what some have called a pretty good "AYP ambassador" in the form of the radio interview -- 45 minutes long, 20MB downloadable MP3. http://www.aypsite.com/audio.html
The more file sharing that can be done with this the better.
The guru is in you.
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 06 2006 : 10:00:20 PM
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| Any news Yogani if you will be doing this again? |
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Athma_Shakti
India
81 Posts |
Posted - Dec 07 2006 : 09:04:23 AM
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viral marketing is a powerful technique to reach the media easily using email broadcasts, IM's, pop's etc..
this will increase number of hits/users also the traffic/load of the server.
and for webmasters and moderators maintaining the forums is the difficult think in the world haha.
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 07 2006 : 10:26:02 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anthem11
Any news Yogani if you will be doing this again?
Hi Andrew:
Tentatively, I am to be on the same show every Sunday evening in January. It will be announced when it is firm.
Or did I just announce it?
The guru is in you. |
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Dec 07 2006 : 11:03:27 AM
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Good news Yogani!
Then hopefully you can have opportunity to go more in depth into the teachings of AYP. |
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ruirib
316 Posts |
Posted - Dec 07 2006 : 10:59:49 PM
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| There is code around to add an rss feed to a Snitz forum. Let me know if you are interested and I'll easily add it. |
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 02:43:23 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by ruirib
There is code around to add an rss feed to a Snitz forum. Let me know if you are interested and I'll easily add it.
To hopefully help clarify (since I started the RSS piece of this thread - actually, the whole thread, come to think of it .... ).
I'm talking about making AYP feeds _available_ TO the world, so that THEY can add AYP feeds to their sites, and/or add an RSS chiclet to their feed reader / browser.
Per Yogani's comments, we would want to do this for the Lessons, and presumably for the Forum as well.
AND "PER THAT", A COUPLE OF NOTES TO YOGANI:
1. RSS is 100% non-invasive, and 100% "opt in" (the user "opts in" to use it). It's purely a convenience to people who frequent the AYP site and forums --- but can be a pretty major one. All it is, in a nutshell, is an easy method for AYP content to "come to" a site participant, rather than the site participant having to "go to" the content.
Example: I'm a lot more likely to participate more often on the Taobums forum, now that I have the RSS feed set-up, as a user (elapsed set-up time, roughly 4.5 seconds - no exaggeration).
All I'm suggesting, is setting up what's technically called a syndication feed of AYP content, so that AYP visitors have the same convenience as Taobums visitors do --- which is why I suggested visiting www.taobums.com, and clicking (at the bottom of the page) on the RSS option - to see exactly what I mean.
You'll see the little Taobums RSS chiclet at the top of your browser, and you'll see what it can do, by clicking on it.
Then, just imagine the same, for AYP.
2. The infinitely more powerful use of the same thing (meaning, you / we set-up the syndication feeds once, and the "world" gets benefits #1 and #2 (the one I'm about to thrill you with ....  ) -- as follows:
Once the AYP syndication feeds are set-up, not only can people add an RSS feed link to their browser, as described above --- but they can add the feeds (one or more, their choice - i.e. one might be certain lessons, another might be the Tantra folder in the Forum, etc. etc.) to _their_ web site or blog.
Essentially, setting up RSS feeds of AYP content, is probably the:
A. Least invasive (see www.taobums.com RSS add-in option at the bottom of their home page.)
B. Easiest (dare I say it .... R_eally S_imple ... ) to set-up (see http://www.xul.fr/en-xml-rss.html
C. Most potentially viral and far-reaching marketing option currently available to AYP.
D. Most Cost-Effective (F-R-E-E ... all it takes is a bit of time, and very minimal technical know-how ... for the most part, it involves cut-n-paste HTML / XML code --- something a bit more complex, like a Snitz Mod, just helps to automate things.)
Well, I'm Kirtan-toast .... - so I'll leave it at that for now.
As I've seen stated several places on the web recently, there's basically no reason NOT to set up a series of RSS feeds, if you have a site -- in fact, it's sort of a new slicker version of giving people access TO your site (AYP, in this case, of course) -- it just contains a lot of built in FREE / automatic marketing options - i.e. RSS syndication services picking up the feeds, which other yoga related sites can offer, etc.
Hope that helps --- and I can definately help with some of this, though if there are those (Kumar? Ruirib?) with more hands-on web / database experience than I have, they may be able to do it easier / faster than I could.)
I will gladly volunteer to help make this happen, and fast, though - for one (per my starting this thread) - I'd love to have the option as an AYP member / participant - and "for two", RSS is an excellent, easy to implement, and FREE (not counting time involvement - which is minimal) - way to promote AYP - in a way that addresses all of Yogani's concerns up front (i.e. it's not invasive, or spammish, it's not bandwidth / throughput intensive, etc.)
Hope this helps - let's discuss / implement - Yogani / Kumar / Ruirib - please advise concerning suggested next steps.
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 07:03:21 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Athma_Shakti
viral marketing is a powerful technique to reach the media easily using email broadcasts, IM's, pop's etc..
this will increase number of hits/users also the traffic/load of the server.
and for webmasters and moderators maintaining the forums is the difficult think in the world haha.
Hi AthmaShakti:
Can you suggest specific programs you can implement yourself? If so, those would be much welcome.
Unsolicited email, IMs, popups or desktop icons are not appropriate -- these are spam.
AYP supporter produced "opt in" marketing programs are what we want, like networking sites (all of them), shared files (interview), links (but not "link exchange" spam), maybe RSS, etc.
Kirtanman, on RSS, I will look into it with Ruirib, our Snitz consultant, and see what can be done. The Taobums RSS only produces a page of code here, maybe because I am still on Win98. This old computer is a well-oiled publishing machine that only requires the writing itself to do it all. Would not want to reinvent that on a new machine until the books are done. Same with the forums and anything else that is working reasonably well on the existing AYP sites. It is a matter of maintaining maximum productivity and efficiency over the next 18 months or so -- a lot of writing still to do!
But spreading the word/marketing programs? Yes, we need much more of it. For that, many hands make light work.
Many thanks to all!
The guru is in you.
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 11:34:00 AM
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Hi Kirtanman:
With some checking, come to find that a reader download is needed for RSS for most computers, and neither Taobums nor Snitz RSS cue the user for that. What you end up with instead is a page full of code. Therefore, it would appear RSS is not ready for the teeming masses out there yet, which is the only reason I would be interested at this time. Maybe later when universality has been better-established.
Unless I am missing something?
The guru is in you. |
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Wolfgang
Germany
470 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 2:03:57 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Unless I am missing something?
May be an isssue of operating system (WIN98 )
Or a browser issue ?
L&L
Wolfgang |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 4:12:53 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Wolfgang
quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Unless I am missing something?
May be an isssue of operating system (WIN98 )
Or a browser issue ?
L&L
Wolfgang
Hi Wolfgang:
I was given to understand that a reader download is needed by many for RSS. I have both MSIE and Firefox here, neither is that far out of date (even though the operating system is old), and neither works with RSS.
Well, one way to settle it is to see who can see this and who can't:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/rss1.asp
What does everyone say?
I just don't think we should be putting up a feature that will confuse lots of folks, and not be useful for spreading the word.
On another matter, your request for gender identification in the member profile did not go unnoticed. It was deliberately left out from the beginning so no one would feel pressured to reveal more about themselves than they wish. If it were active, the gender question would not be mandatory, but just having it there could send the wrong message, particularly in view of some of the subject matter we are covering here. Keep in mind that many experiences are being shared here that have rarely been revealed in public before, and with very good benefits so far. We do not wish to jade it in any way. Less on exactly who is doing the sharing can be more! Those who want to reveal their gender will find a way ... that has been the philosophy so far, and it seems to work. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
The guru is in you.
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Dec 08 2006 : 5:08:54 PM
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| Both the browser and operating system apparently need to be fairly recent to be able to read RSS feeds directly. I can not read them with Windows 98 second ed. and Internet Explorer 5.0, or with Windows 2000 and Internet Explorer 5.0 or Netscape 7.0. |
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Athma_Shakti
India
81 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 03:10:44 AM
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<html><head><body bgcolor="lemonchiffon">
<script language="vbscript">
dim xmlDoc
Set xmlDoc = CreateObject("microsoft.xmldom")
xmlDoc.async = false
xmlDoc.load("http://www.aypsite.org/forum/rss1.asp")
document.write(xmlDoc.documentElement.text)
</script></body></html>
its a simple (test)program to decode the data from rss file, copy and save it as ".html" file. if everyone can see the data, then i will enhance it by adding proper interface.
RSS feed is good idea from Kirtanman, how far its practical here not sure, needs idea from everyone.
Thanx
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Kirtanman
USA
1651 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 03:18:56 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by yogani
quote:
Originally posted by Wolfgang
quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Unless I am missing something?
May be an isssue of operating system (WIN98 )
Or a browser issue ?
L&L
Wolfgang
Hi Wolfgang:
I was given to understand that a reader download is needed by many for RSS. I have both MSIE and Firefox here, neither is that far out of date (even though the operating system is old), and neither works with RSS.
Well, one way to settle it is to see who can see this and who can't:
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/rss1.asp
What does everyone say?
I just don't think we should be putting up a feature that will confuse lots of folks, and not be useful for spreading the word.
On another matter, your request for gender identification in the member profile did not go unnoticed. It was deliberately left out from the beginning so no one would feel pressured to reveal more about themselves than they wish. If it were active, the gender question would not be mandatory, but just having it there could send the wrong message, particularly in view of some of the subject matter we are covering here. Keep in mind that many experiences are being shared here that have rarely been revealed in public before, and with very good benefits so far. We do not wish to jade it in any way. Less on exactly who is doing the sharing can be more! Those who want to reveal their gender will find a way ... that has been the philosophy so far, and it seems to work. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
The guru is in you.
Hi Yogani & All,
Initially, I thought this was likely an operating system issue ...
... but that actually appears to not be the case.
First, this article may contain the answer:
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/net.../01/rss.html" target="_blank"> br / http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/net.../01/rss.html
Second, I understand why, if you're not familiar with RSS, that you'll perceive separate software as being needed (the mention of a "reader" - makes it sound somewhat akin to a PDF reader, or some-such.)
However, pragmatically speaking, that isn't the case --- because RSS reading capability has been integrated directly into current browsers (Firefox 2.0 and IE 7 -- and I believe a version or two back, or at least a partial version or two back, for each.)
For instance, when I click on the Taobums RSS (or any other RSS) link, Firefox recognizes the RSS feed, and saves it as a Bookmark, and puts an RSS icon in the toolbar.
When I click on it, I see links to the five most recent Taobums message threads(the titles).
(And I believe that number is flexible - some of my RSS links show five, others ten or fifteeen.)
When I click on the link -- I go directly to that message thread.
As another example, check out www.dooce.com -- the ever-increasingly popular exploits of a formerly hard-drinking, currently medicated Salt Lake City housewife with an attitude.
Currently one of the most popular sites on the web, which says a lot .... about something.
(Primarily Heather Armstrong's wit and writing ability.)
She was fired from her former job for blogging, and now makes enough from it to support her family.
Clicking on this link will illustrate why:
http://www.dooce.com/shop/" target="_blank"> br / http://www.dooce.com/shop/
(It will not, however, explain exactly why she was flown to New York to be interviewed on CNN, or why she is invited to keynote at industry conferences ... but that is a topic for another day, and/or another forum.)
I'm entioning Dooce here, though, per the fact that Heather ("Dooce"), doesn't have an RSS feed for forum posts (per no forum) -- but rather, her blog entries.
So, RSS can basically be set up for any content that can be "demarcated" - whether forum posts, AYP Lessons, blog entries if there are ever AYP blogs, and so on.
And (finally) -- clicking on the AYP RSS link -- I see the same XML code that everyone else sees (and I'm running XP w/SP2, Firefox 2.0) -- which tells me that the article link at the beginning of this post may contain the answer, after-all.
As cool as open-source is (especially the general FREE-ness of it all) - many blog (as with Dooce) or forum (as with Taobums) applications offer RSS feed creation as part of the software.
Since Snitz requires kind of a DIY approach, certain technical additions may be more than a one-step process .... but per the link ip above (posted here again for convenience -
hwww.oreillynet.com/pub/a/net...7/01/rss.html" target="_blank">ttp://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/net...7/01/rss.html - it appears that this one additional step, which looks fairly easy --- may be the needed fix.)
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman
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weaver
832 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 09:54:59 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Athma_Shakti
<html><head><body bgcolor="lemonchiffon">
<script language="vbscript">
dim xmlDoc
Set xmlDoc = CreateObject("microsoft.xmldom")
xmlDoc.async = false
xmlDoc.load("http://www.aypsite.org/forum/rss1.asp")
document.write(xmlDoc.documentElement.text)
</script></body></html>
its a simple (test)program to decode the data from rss file, copy and save it as ".html" file. if everyone can see the data, then i will enhance it by adding proper interface.
Athma_Shakti,
I saved this code as an HTML file and ran it in IE 5 and Netscape 7, but only the yellow background shows up. And I do have active scripting enabled. |
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yogani
USA
5196 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 11:01:22 AM
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Hi All:
I'm afraid I don't have a clue what all this RSS talk is about. If we can't show a simple icon that everyone can point and click for the result, it will not be implemented here. It is as simple as that.
But feel free to use the beta link above.
If at some point it becomes a simple point and click feature for everyone, then let me know. Keep in mind that administrative time available here for setting up and operating this sort of program is zero. So if it is going to be done, someone else has to do it. Right now it looks like a can of worms. 
Sorry, that's just how it is at this stage of AYP development. It is as much about the offline stuff as the online stuff, and there are only so many hours in the day.
The guru is in you.
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Athma_Shakti
India
81 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2006 : 4:17:02 PM
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hi Weaver
http://www.aypsite.org/forum/rss1.asp
click on the above link
"rss1.asp" page has been moved or removed, thats why the script is unable to read the page. |
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AYP Forum 2.0? -- RSS
