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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 14 2005 : 01:38:06 AM
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Hari Om
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Hello folks, I think this subject goes here. if not may I request the move to the right folder so I can note it.
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I thought I would comment on mantra's for those that have interest or care to add a point or two.
Its interesting to note that on AYP "I AM" is used. I AM was the vehicle Nisargadatta Mahararaj was given to ( by his guru) to bring him enlightenment. Maharaj was a householder that lived in Bombay.
He passed in 1981 , so a relatively neo-classical mukti that was enlightened. He is known as being Part of the Navnath ( or 9) Sampradaya or linage. He calls the use of I AM the Nisarga (Natural)Yoga. What is uncanny, is he received his instructions from his guru, listened/executed and within A short time ( under 5 years) realized Being.
This "I AM" is phonetically AIM. A wonderful bija (seed) mantra officially called bijakshara for "seed syllable" - that of Saraswati. AS you know she is associated with Brahma the creator.
She provides the power of knowledge, speech and intelligence. Her name Saraswati is made up of Sa-rasa-wati; made of 7 rasa's (rasa known as essence or delight, and is from ras or "to feel or be sensible of") comes from sweet, sour , salty, bitter, pungent, astringent, and Suddha Jala or pure water.
Her Mantra , AIM, some spell it EIM for phonetics, is the bija or seed for this shakti (or power/energy) and enlivens
this quality in the nervous system or village of the senses as it is known. Her name is also Saras or "flowing" and vati or "having" - called She of the stream.
The "AE" sound is owned by the sun - it is also the Jala (water) bija/seed as Saraswati is associated with water as we just discussed.
From her, one can anticipate success (siddhi or accomplishments) in good actions, establishing justice, an end to enmity and of course vidya or knowledge
So , back to Mantras:
As Yogani has alluded to many times, mantra is a collection of "akshara" - meaning both sounds or phonemes - akshara is also anther name for infinity . The whole science of mantra shastra concerns itself with the vibrations and enlivenment of the nervous system. What is of great interest ( to me) is the intent of the USE of the mantra - that is, from Shanti ( pacification/peace)to Vasyam ( captivation) or even marana ( not the Italian tomato sauce!) but that of eradication. This body of knowledge is called Shadkarma or 6 actions.
As mantras go, there are rules that govern the creation of a mantra e.g. its source ( mantroddhara) , the repetitions or purascharna ( more for japa), its Chanda or it rhythm, and some talk of its kindling or dipana or lighting the inner lamp with the mantra. And of Chaitanya or infusing the mantra with spiritual energy - hence the reason for a guru giving the mantra to the student (called Gurupadesatoh mantra).
There is a whole body of knowledge in mantra shastra that deals with what sounds are best for the native i.e. most suitable, and which are "ari", also known as satru or "enemy". This is called Akshara Samudaya.
Best to depart on this note and see if there is any interest...
Om shanti shanti shanti
Frank in SD
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Edited by - Adam West on Aug 14 2005 03:31:04 AM |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2005 : 10:16:27 AM
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Hello Frank in San Diego,
Here is some of my take on the mantra sounds, based partly on what I have heard and significantly on personal experience also.
The mantra you mention, the one you phonetically spell AIM is indeed very good. In fact, I used it for about 20 years and still use it a lot.
It is very close to, but not quite the same as the IAM that Yogani recommends.
The difference is visible in English counterparts -- AIM is close to I'm in English -- IAM is close to I am in English.
There is a difference that could have some importance on a subtle level. AIM is a single-pole mantra and tends to send the energy upwards into the higher chakras and stimulate them very well.
The IAM recommended by Yogani is a dual-pole mantra which stimulates the lower chakras and the higher ones.
Picture AIM as a bottle-washer that starts in the middle of the bottle and shoots to the top of the bottle and scrubs vigorously there; But IAM on the other hand plunges from the middle of the bottle to the top where it scrubs a bit, then plunges all the way down into the bottom of the bottle and scrubs there too.
You may be able to feel this difference yourself. Let me do a quick tour of how these mantras split up, and what happens when they are viewed in 'slow motion':
AIM (I'm) --- splits up into Aaaah --- Eeeee ---- MMMMMM
IAM (I am) --- splits up into Aaaaah --- Eeeee ---- AaahMMMMM
In both mantras, the Aaaaah gathers the energy from the heart area. Then they both proceed into the Eeeeee sound, which stimulates the head and upper chakras.
In the first though, the Eeeee sound, which stimulates the upper chakras, rolls right into, and continues to ring, in the MMMMM. By the way, the 'Eeeee' sound is still there, ringing away, even when we are in the 'MMMMM'. We are not aware of that in conscious speech, but it is happening. The 'Eeeee' rings into the MMMMM, and scrubs the 'top of the bottle'. Then it goes into silence.
In the second, the Eeeee sound, which stimulates the upper chakras, goes back 'down' into the 'aaaah' sound, into the heart and center body and even back down into the root, and it is the 'aaaaaah' that continues to ring and resonate, into the MMMMM. The 'Aaaaaah' resonates in the MMMMM, and scrubs the 'middle and bottom of the bottle'. Then it goes into silence.
By the way, I would recomment that you say the 'IAM' with a British 'am', not an American one. We are aiming for an 'a' in the 'am' which is like the 'aaaaaah' you might say if you moan in relief or pleasure, or to sooth an infant or child; a nice, heart-soothing 'aaaaah'. In most places in the US anyway (I don't know about all) the 'a' in 'I am' is quite a different sound to this 'aaaah' of which I speak. The 'a' in the British 'I am' is much closer.
By the way, whereas I have split up the mantra, it is only for illustration of the effect of the sounds, and to show how to get the sounds right. But they are pronounced smoothly -- they rool into each other without break and with normal speed.
Yogani is quite aware, by the way, of the difference between these mantras. He chose IAM, as opposed to AIM, quite deliberately, as being a better general-purpose mantra, presumably because of the double-pole effect.
But while one mantra may be a better general-purpose mantra, this does not mean that others would not be better in special cases. A good outer or inner guru may tell when to make exceptions.
I hope someone found that intersting or helpful.
-David |
Edited by - david_obsidian on Jan 10 2006 1:08:02 PM |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2005 : 4:59:28 PM
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Thanks for the clarification Obsidian. While I am aware of the Bija Mantra "Ayim" I also can tell the difference internally from I AM.
I found myself doing the mantra as "I'M' and when I changed it to AaaaaYaaaam I noticed that a constriction in the throat melted away and teh meditation deepened and relaxed. I hadn't realized that some resistance that I had been experiencing in meditation had to do with subtleties of the mantra. |
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2005 : 5:47:32 PM
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Hari Om
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David/Victor
Excellent info... yes, this science of mantra shasta is wonderful.
As Victor commented a little change in the bija, changes the resonance and its effects.
That is why I have said for years "Any sound is NOT good enough" and should be from someone who has a clue on how to do this -OR- one should pick a Pra-siddha mantra e.g. Om Namo Naraayanaya or Nama Shivaya ( both with a specific number of syllables for a specific effect.
As mantras a build, they then add additional sounds/resonances that compliment each other. Interesting to note David's comment on IM too.. This is a bija mantra for Vishnu , and it has its place, as does I AM and AIM
Another rendition of Saraswati's biji is AINGthis is one I use ..sounds more like AhaaeenGa ( the past part is aspirated)
and is very complimentary inside other mala ( string of bija) mantras.
More on this later if you wish to discuss e.g. the key bija mantra's, who owns them, what mantras are a good fit, when to they mature or bring fruit , etc. We might discover some new ideas.
Thanks again for your notes and insights.
Om Shanti Shanti Shantiye
Frank ( not in Stein Germany thank God!) in San Diego |
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patelvipulk
18 Posts |
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lucidinterval1
USA
193 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2005 : 9:27:37 PM
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Thanks Vipul,
This is a giant 156 page treatise. I will take the time to read through this.
Thanks,
Paul |
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Jan 15 2006 : 2:11:57 PM
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Hari Om
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IN some past posts on this thread and on a thread on TM, there's been some good discussions on Mantras. David posted some very insightful info from his experiences using I AM and compared and contrasted it with other mantra discussions. Conversations are posted http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=408.
Part 1
I thought I would add a new piece of info - now when I say I , its really the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, and the Purusha-vidya Brahmana. If this is of interest to you, please read on.
As we meditate experience + knowledge round out the meditator's unfoldment, Hence my contributions to AYP.
This Brahmana starts off "In the beginning ( all good stories start like this…!) all this was verily the SELF in the form of a person. Observing all round HE did not behold/see anything other then HIMSELF. HE first said I AM (he)".
So, for those that use I AM as a mantra, note your lineage. HE was the first being to have a body. The sruti's say ' Virat was the first person'. HE expressed to HIMSELF - I AM. [ I'd say you folks are in good company!] This Virat, is known as viraj, or the manifest universe; This Virat, is the sum total of all bodies in the universe. The Brahmana states that "this very SELF enters into all bodies up to their nail-ends". That’s why many a sage declare "all this is nothing but the SELF".
Point being made - the I AM mantra is a profound bija, and was the first word spoken in this creation.
Part 2
This virat is also known as Purusha -this word has multiple meanings, yet it is from purvam aushat or, 'first burned'. What was burned? HE was the first to 'burn up' the attachment to the senses by virtue of meditation.
Its said in this Brahmana that he who knows this ( practices this meditation) consumes the evils - code word for removing the attachment of the senses to their objects, becomes identified with virat, SELF. That is, one realizes SELF i.e. enlightenment.
Part 3 - Extra Credit Area
Nothing is independent of virat, SELF, Purusha - yet it may feel like this to us. The process of 'creation' is creating name and form from the SELF, without the SELF losing its wholeness. IT may look like a part or specific thing, yet IT is the ubiquitous SELF that cannot be divided into many. This is the classical definition of ignorance - observing and believing that infinity is parsed out as the many.
So, as the SELF enters all things up to its 'nail-ends' (this would be us), the SELF, when breathing is prana by name; IT is speech while speaking, IT is seeing when IT is the eye, and hearing when the ear. ALL are names and forms this SELF takes.
All the powers we use *imagination, thinking, memory, sensing*, are just a miniature version of the Cosmic Mind, SELF/Purusha.
What's the deal? Why even mention this? Because this Purusha-vidya Brahmana clearly states YOU can realize this through this meditation.
Tat-tvam-asi or THAT thou art - one of the 4 greatest Truths or Mahavakas of the Vedas. Your I AM is the vehicle to this realization.
Peace,
Frank In San Diego
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Juliet
43 Posts |
Posted - Jan 15 2006 : 10:39:04 PM
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When I got initiated into TM as a kid my mantra was IM.
As all the X-TMers out there know, your personal mantra was supposedly ultra top-secret and somehow mystically manifest just for you--but turned out years later that ALL girls (under 14 or something) got issued IM.
Juliet
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rabar
USA
64 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2006 : 11:14:55 PM
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Howdy, AYPers... (like that name - I also talk about 'going AYP).
I'm really enjoying the discussion here, and a long-time mantra-
enjoyer and user.
David Obsidian wrote:
"By the way, I would recommend that you say the 'IAM' with a British 'am', not an American one."
Although I like ‘Ah’ as a seed syllable, and also 'Awe'(for me it triggers empathy and compassion), if I sound the ‘I am’ aloud (instead of silently as Yogani suggests), I do prefer the flat ‘a’ as in ‘ham.’
Why? Because it cannot be said without a smile. I’m very partial to the smile because it triggers endorphins (according to Paul Ekman at UCSF, the facial features expert). Of course 'Eem' also triggers the smile, and is closer to the sound I hear constantly (louder in a headstand which for this reasons I presume has something to do with the crown chakra.)
Frank-in-San-Diego wrote:
“So, for those that use I AM as a mantra, note your lineage. HE was the first being to have a body. The sruti's say ' Virat was the first person'. HE expressed to HIMSELF - I AM. [ I'd say you folks are in good company!] This Virat, is known as viraj, or the manifest universe; This Virat, is the sum total of all bodies in the universe.”
I could put up a good argument for the first manifestation being SHE. Aditi, mother of the Adityas... and in some texts the mother of the universe. I think males came along later as an a cosmic afterthought – sort of a female with a prolapsed uterus.
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2006 : 01:41:40 AM
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Hari OM
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quote:
Originally posted by rabar
I could put up a good argument for the first manifestation being SHE. Aditi, mother of the Adityas.
Hello rabar,
yes, good point and I believe not much of an argument is needed...
as the Divine Mother S/he is being first( adi) and is absolutely boundless (a="not" + diti ="limit"); also without decay = a+di.
All Glory to HER - the source of all cosmic forms of consciousness that brings about Aditya - or Surya, the sun and the owner of the Atma.
Om shaantih shaantih shaantih
Frank In San Diego
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Edited by - Frank-in-SanDiego on Jan 19 2006 9:26:20 PM |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2006 : 09:32:42 AM
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Rabar said:
I think males came along later as an a cosmic afterthought – sort of a female with a prolapsed uterus.
Hello Rabar,
I'm personally wary of any myth that gives primacy or priority (of any kind) to either of the genders. Those myths can start out with good intentions, and can be clean of the 'dark side' originally, but they can get easily co-opted by the 'dark side', and can feed into 'identity narcissistic' sexism, whether of the male or the female kind.
I think Male and female arose as complementary opposites to each other, like lock and key. I think the myths that reflect that reality are probably the healthiest and safest for general use!
That's just my opinion -- I'm not saying your myth is not good for you.  I'd just hope you don't inadvertently feed my neighborhood man-haters!!
Best regards,
-D |
Edited by - david_obsidian on Jan 19 2006 11:00:34 AM |
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Frank-in-SanDiego
USA
363 Posts |
Posted - Jan 19 2006 : 9:41:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by david_obsidian
I'm personally wary of any myth that gives primacy or priority (of any kind) to either of the genders.
I think Male and female arose as complementary opposites to each other,
Hello David,Rabar,
If I may I can see the audit trail behind this conversation and it points back to me using the word HE.
I used capital letters out of respect, not out of rubbing anyone's nose into the possibility the Purusha is male or female. And, I used He ( masculine) as that is how this view of the Universal Spirit was depicted in the Upanishads. I will be the last person to change this or argue the rishi's of yore got it wrong.
That is why my view is so flexible - in the final analysis all 'this' is Consciousness, that is infinitely intelligent. That is, it IS intelligence itself. This Consciousness IS every thing we see and do not see... and its beyond that too.
So, Male? Female? yes, and everything else.
Peace,
Frank In San Diego
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Mantra's ...some ideas, some insights
