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mikael
27 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 01 2007 : 10:58:20 PM
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http://www.hamsa-yoga.org/
Yogiraj Gurunath Siddhanath
have you guys heard of him? i found him on youtube randomly, and I like his message. I'm interested in kriya yoga so I met with a teacher of his and he gave me a short lesson. i have heard great things about Yogiraj but for me to be initiated (i go and meet Yogiraj and he gives me blessings and his shakti), i have to pay a one time donation of 108$, which the teacher assures me is for a temple they are building. it is a non profit organization.. but me being a skeptical westerner I ask for advice. since I am as weary of charlatans as any of you. would a true guru ask for money as initiation? the teacher assures me it is one time, and that i will be a student of the Guru for life... what do you guys think? |
Edited by - AYPforum on Aug 06 2007 3:32:09 PM |
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Victor
USA
910 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 02:06:16 AM
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| I have seen the guy on youtube and like what he has to say. He seems to have a sense of humor and good perspective. look at it this way. If you went to a doctor for a physical he would charge you $100 per visit. i don't think a gurus time is worth less than a doctors.Whether he is a true satguru or your true guru remains to be seen but it doesn't sounds to me like a huge donation |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 06:56:54 AM
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I haven't seen or heard of him, but I'd be wary of a teacher who asked me for any amount of money so early in the game, and especially in exchange for his blessings and shaktipat. It's true that $108. isn't an enormous amount of money, but there are enough people for whom it would be prohibitive. It's a small enough amount that he could surely make it up in donations if he opened the gate a little wider. But maybe that's his purpose - to narrow the gate in order to reserve his blessings for the more seriously devout - in which case I suppose it's a functional system. There are other ways to weed out the less committed, but charging a fee has its obvious benefits.
I guess I'm spoiled by the price tag on Yogani's teachings and Amma's blessings. If I was a guru, it would break my heart to know that I wasn't able to reach some people simply because they were too poor or put off to come to me. I'd forgo the temple in favor of followers. |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 07:26:14 AM
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Hi,
Irrespective of the money I would be cautious of anyone who offered shaktipat before they have even met you. In my experience even with the grace of the guru one needs to prepare and purify oneself as much as possible beforehand to minimise excessive side effects of shaktipat.I know of some who have had shaktipat and suffered such effects, much like when one needs to self pace.Shaktipat is very powerful and life changing
so one needs to prepare accordingly.
L&L
Dave |
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Thokar
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 6:49:51 PM
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mikael,
Just so you know.... The man you are talking about was a self-realization fellowship student... he learned kriya yoga through their lessons like most other people... I don't believe his story's of meeting with Babaji in the least... Don't waste your money.. If you want to learn kriya yoga, goto www.kriyayogainfo.net They have a free downloadable book which covers EVERY technique of kriya yoga with much better explanation of it than what gurunath can... Also by the way this guy claims to be part of the Nath sect in India, but the nath have never even heard of him.. |
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mikael
27 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 8:55:44 PM
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Thank you all.
Thokar, are you sure about this? where did you get that info from?
I've been thinking, and yes I can get all the info I want from online but the main thing that is attracting me to him is the shaktipat (i will definetely prepare myself before hand, i was already taught pranayama techniques), you can't get shakti from the internet can you? :P it is to my understanding that receiving shaktipat greatly speeds up the process, or maybe I am wrong |
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mikael
27 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 9:35:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by riptiz
Hi,
Irrespective of the money I would be cautious of anyone who offered shaktipat before they have even met you. In my experience even with the grace of the guru one needs to prepare and purify oneself as much as possible beforehand to minimise excessive side effects of shaktipat.I know of some who have had shaktipat and suffered such effects, much like when one needs to self pace.Shaktipat is very powerful and life changing
so one needs to prepare accordingly.
L&L
Dave
Dave,
I tried emailing you but I don't have enough posts.
I read in one of your other posts that you received Shaktipat. i'd love to hear some of your experiences. I read about it in Play of Consciousness by Swami Muktananda but that book is littered with religious jargon, i'd love to hear an actual experience.
please email me, mixolyd at gmail.com
thank you.
Mikael |
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Thokar
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - Aug 02 2007 : 10:17:10 PM
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| It is my and other's experience that the only thing needed is your own daily practice... If you get it in your head you have to have someones "shaktipat" then by all means go ahead but I can promise you it won't have even 1% of the effect of a normal daily established practice... |
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mufad
44 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2007 : 04:19:59 AM
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Mikael,
In such matters advice is best sought from the guru in you, since you ask here I feel inclined to point out to you that even a true guru may allow an organization (or administration committee) to form around himself if it serves the purpose to spread his message. Though the guru may not have any attraction for money, the organization has its needs, so the guru does not object to rules being made about the minimum charge for shaktipath. I have no idea if the person you mention is a genuine guru who can give shakthipath, but I feel there is no harm in trying.
If you feel benefited by the lesson you received, and if you feel attracted to the teachings of this person, then you should not let money come in the way, it is a formality, just give and forget, it is not important, money never is - and as many have pointed out it is not a big amount. You cannot buy enlightenment, even if you are ready to spend millions of dollars. One to whom a genuine guru stretches out his hand, is fortunate indeed. He is doing you a favor by accepting your money. Though he may possess the whole universe, still its from you that he seeks. The risk of turning away from a true guru is far greater than mistaking a fake guru for a true one. At best you may receive a good push to boost your daily practice, at worst you may be wiser from whatever experience you receive.
Lastly, the real guru is in you, all those who are in tune with the guru in themselves serve as a vehicle for you to reach your guru.
Let us know how it goes,
Best,
Mufad.
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Edited by - mufad on Aug 03 2007 06:37:26 AM |
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sadhak
India
604 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2007 : 04:26:39 AM
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Hi Mikael,
Not meaning to discourage you, but am curious - why are you so eager to have a shaktipat? Do you definitely know that it is going to alter your life? (BTW did you read what ayp has to say about it?) What Thokar says above has something in it, as hundereds of practitioners will tell you. I think one of the myths that drives an aspirant is "If only I got that perfect system/mantra/guru ..etc I'm going to get enlightenment/ a move on/something else.  |
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mikael
27 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2007 : 9:41:56 PM
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i just want to find a real master to learn from, and to receive shakti from. not that i doubt myself, i'd just like to speed up the process.
is there anyway for me to know whether or not Yogiraj Gurunath Siddhanath is a real master that can really give shakti? it's not about the money, i just don't want to waste time.
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Edited by - mikael on Aug 03 2007 10:08:09 PM |
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Thokar
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - Aug 04 2007 : 4:05:02 PM
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He's a waste of your time... there have been numerous discussions about him on the kriya yoga discussion board.. http://www.boards2go.com/boards/boa...?&user=Kriya
Go to that forum and ask about him... You will receieve lots of answers...
As I stated before... the only way he even knows kriya yoga is because he learned kriya from the SRF lessons... He was never initated by babaji as he so claims... Also, as I said he claims to be affiliated with the Nath sect in India but they claim to have never heard of him..
If my answers not enough for you then goto that website forum and ask.. You will get more than enough info about him... |
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Hannah
38 Posts |
Posted - Aug 04 2007 : 6:59:07 PM
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I have no knowledge of him as a teacher or guru, but I have encountered him on the astral a few times and he has an ~extremely~ strong albeit very loving energy. Bout knocked me over.  |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2007 : 03:50:09 AM
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| A bit off topic, but mufad!!! Thank you for those very wise words! I have started to get an issue with money, since I've been lacking them all my life and now finally have been able to save some the last year. It feels hard then to spend large amounts of money on "uncertain", "non-guaranteed" spiritual events, but your words made me calm again. I didn't have money before if I run out of them I'm just back to normal! Money want to be spent, giving me experiences, teaching me lessons of whatever kind! I will benefit from spending it, and money wants to move! That's their job! Sitting still on an account is not their nature! Thanks again! You solved a little mind problem of mine very quickly! |
Edited by - emc on Aug 05 2007 03:51:17 AM |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2007 : 1:32:43 PM
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Hi Mikael,
I am on holiday at moment but will post to you when I return. If you look on the forum you will find somewhere my experiences of shaktipat.Forget anything you have been told about the effects of shaktipat unless you have either experienced it or listened to one who has.Shaktipat will boost ones progress but it is not a substitute for daily practice but it will greatly accelerate progress.
L
L
Dave |
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Juliet
43 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2007 : 4:29:01 PM
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As the daughter of a longtime Muktananda follower, and someone who has been to many of Sidda Yoga's mass shaktipat events--The Shaktipat experience is a great turbo booster, but maybe just that--not some absolute key. The Shaktipat thing actually reminds me a little bit of the Catholic Church, where they control the access to heaven. Viva gnosis!
I think Yogani's right on this one: "the guru is in you." |
Edited by - Juliet on Aug 05 2007 4:56:32 PM |
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Chiron
Russia
397 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2007 : 03:41:48 AM
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| The act of donating money to a spiritual master results in your material merits being converted into spiritual ones. As a result your spiritual progress is boosted, provided the person you donate your money to is of a high spiritual level and your money is used for the spiritual development of others. To determine whether Yogiraj Siddhanath is a genuine master you will need to consult your heart, as has been said here already. Personally, if it were me, I would give much more than $108 (which is obviously a symbolic figure) to receive a Shivapat from him, but that's just my feelings.. |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2007 : 11:17:49 AM
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I believe that the tendancy to believe that potential gurus are sharply divided into 'true gurus' and not-true gurus is a mistake. All people have an array of power, vision, purity and skill as well as an array of befuddlement, short-sightedness, impurity and inadequacy. The same is true of traditions.
The division even into 'true guru' and 'charlatan' isn't even sharp. Some of the much-beloved famous spiritual teachers of the 20th century are both 'true guru' and 'charlatan'!! They are charlatans because they used deception as a significant part of their teaching act. This is part of their imperfection, their inadequacy, their befuddlement and short-sightedness. They often do it quite unconsciously, because their 'tradition' has taught them to. And therein is the imperfection, inadequacy, befuddlement and short-sightedness of their tradition. On the other hand, some of these people are 'true gurus' too -- they served as helpful spiritual guides to many.
And so it goes. It would be easier if everything were black and white. But it isn't. So, enjoy maya, but keep all your lights on and manouver always with care. It's a jungle out there, with light and darkness in everything! 
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Edited by - david_obsidian on Aug 06 2007 2:52:58 PM |
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AYPforum
351 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2007 : 3:32:09 PM
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| Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement |
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riptiz
United Kingdom
741 Posts |
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Hannah
38 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2007 : 6:12:43 PM
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| The topic of guru and donation can be messy. On the one hand, it is often seen as an "energy exchange", and often here in the West, "energy" means money. In such an instance, a donation or dakshina is entirely approprite. Of course, there are always those unfortunate situations when someone with a little more experience will exploit a student, charging way too much. I have seen it from both sides, and will just hold judgement on this. |
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mikael
27 Posts |
Posted - Aug 13 2007 : 7:21:30 PM
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I think I may give him a try.
by the way Thokar, i read that book on kriya you suggested and it was quite interesting, i also emailed the author and asked him about Yogiraj and he said he is aware of him and his teachings and had nothing negative to say. |
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pratheepa
India
1 Posts |
Posted - Aug 27 2007 : 04:20:04 AM
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hi, Can any one help me in having a good yoga teacher in Adyar, chennai.
I m in search of yoga teacher for past 1 year, but couldnt find any one.Guys can u pls help me in finding out it.
Thanks,
Pratheepa |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Aug 27 2007 : 07:40:25 AM
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| Of course, "having nothing negative to say" is not a recommendation. |
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SuperTrouper
USA
49 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2007 : 2:37:03 PM
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Everyone knows that when we begin a spiritual journey, it's marked mostly by searching. And we go on doing mostly searching, and little practicing. But once you've become exhausted jumping through intellectual hoops and delighting in the mental paradigm shifts, the fun of it wears out, and then we quit running around outside, and start running inside (ie, stop it, and start practicing). We sometimes meet a great many people on this journey, hoping to learn or get something new from them -- something more exciting than what we already have. There's a subtle balance that needs to be maintained, however. Some organizations and gurus mentally condition their followers to be "content" with the little that they provide them, often insinuating disloyalty on the part of the follower by yearning for something greater still.
I have seen the videos of Gurunath, and it's true that he's quite charismatic. However, I think $108 is the westerner donation amount. Because for most people in India, that's a large sum of money. 1 rupee = 2.4 cents. Most Indian gurus and spiritual teachers know very well about the differences in the standard of living between India and western countries, and take full advantage of our affluence, by jacking up prices for westerners. Prices that many of their Indian disciples wince at the thought of. Anyway, his videos resemble the kriya more along the lines of yogi bhajan -- which doesn't resemble the kriyas of AYP, Satyananda, or any of the Lahiri Mahasaya Disciples. For some reason, any guru new on the scene is immediately branded as an ex-SRF person by SRF members. I think the reason for this is the "our path is the best" mentality of SRF. In his case, it may be true that he's an ex-SRF. Many yogis are. But it's just grape-vine rumors without any supporting evidence.
Anyone could give you shaktipat. But the strength of it and whether or not it will actually have any effect or influence on you is directly related to that person's own spiritual development. How do you know if someone's spiritually developed? For pretty much everyone, this is impossible. So, the only way to know if their shaktipat is effective, is to compare it with that of others - PY, Swami Rama, Vivekananda, etc. However, all of these people had been meditating intensely for years before they received the shaktipat experience we all imagine when we think of the word shaktipat. Apparently you can blow out your entire nervous system if it happens prematurely.
People who don't practice yoga and meditation have little personal experience against which to figure out if a "guru" is spiritually endowed, or a common charlatan. People who don't put any effort into being able to hear the inner guru through yoga practice, have a difficult time finding and listen to external gurus. They usually end up not practicing anything and have fooled themselves that they ever left square 1.
I personally don't practice Satyananda kriya yoga anymore. I'd achieved great success from it, but 20 kriyas was too much and I found myself hindered by them. I thought it would be easier if I had a simpler system of kriya. I always adored Lahiri Mahasaya, his life, and they way he taught. I ended up finding, by somewhat serendipitous circumstances, the website that's often quoted in these forums -- www.kriyayogainfo.net . I downloaded and read the book and instructions ravenously. I was already versed and practiced in the essential techniques of kriya, so it was a pretty easy transition. The techniques of Lahiri Mahasaya are simply amazing in their effectiveness. If a person is genuinely interested in kriya as a spiritual practice, then definitely this is worth trying for a couple months to see (especially for those considering an expensive trip to India for initiations by someone they've never met before). Nearly every system of kriya uses the essential components found in Lahiri Mahasaya's kriya (except, as I said, yogi bhajan's). So, the techniques in this book are the magna opus upon which to judge all other systems of kriya.
This is pretty long winded, and I probably lost track a couple times, but hope this helps some. |
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guru and donation?
