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BellaMente
USA
147 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 18 2010 : 1:31:03 PM
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God-consciousness...Gnosis....Enlightenment...Self-realization...
There's a lot of talk about it... but what is it really?
How do you know when you have crossed this line? What are the signs that one has reached this goal?
And why the H does it seem to take so long to get there?
Can bhakti alone bring you to such a place?
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wakeupneo
USA
171 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2010 : 2:52:59 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by BellaMente
God-consciousness...Gnosis....Enlightenment...Self-realization...
There's a lot of talk about it... but what is it really?
How do you know when you have crossed this line? What are the signs that one has reached this goal?
And why the H does it seem to take so long to get there?
Can bhakti alone bring you to such a place?
According to the teachings which I follow (Anadi) there are three types of enlightenment...sort of speak.
Enlightenment of consciousness... A shift of identity from the 'me', egoic personalty, movement of thoughts... to pure consciousness. Fully an totally embodying the "I AMness" of who you are
Enlightenment of the heart... Opening the spiritual heart center. Essentially the seat of the soul. One's identity shifts to this center. The "I AMness" of the heart center is awakened and embodied.
Enlightenment to the absolute... The is what Nisargadatta talks about when he says prior to consciousness. It is the background of consciousness. It is energetically located at the 'hara' The absolute is not a state per say, it's actually another dimension, beyond time and space.
There seems to be different types of enlightenment and varying forms of it. Enlightenment doesn't seem to be this static 'ah ha' I got it! and your done. Much of Zen literature and neo-advaita seems to suggest this. But I don't think that is the case. The 'ah-ha' is nothing more than awakening to the "I AMness" of pure consciousness.
Why does it take so long to get there you ask...
Who is asking the question?
Because you insist on keeping that 'entity' that is seeking, strving, growing, alive. As does 99.9% of the population.
Because we insist on it taking so long to get there. Cause we aren't willing to let go of the dream, of the 'me'. We constantly, moment to moment, recreat this false little 'me'. We are the ones that are consciously keeping it alive.
You ARE already awake! This is true. Unfortunately on many levels we are so conditioned to live otherwise. That's like telling your child there is a Santa Clause and all the childs friends and teachers and everyone reinforces this idea of Santa Clause. If some one for the first times tells the child there is no Santa, the child will not believe that person. It will take some time and de-conditioning. Probably a bad example, but we are conditioned to a MUCH greater degeree.
While doing all these Sadhanas can strengthen the 'me' it's my experience that on some level the boundaries being the relative and the absolute become less dense. Thus making it easier to see our reality...or in Zen our original face, Buddha nature.
So before ,during, after practice, understand that 'YOU' are not the one practicing.
Please not tha my understanding of Anadi's teachings is still rather limited. Everything I say comes from a limited perspective but this is how I understanding things from the tiny veil which I have lifted in the grand mystery.
Love,
J |
Edited by - wakeupneo on Jan 18 2010 3:03:45 PM |
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adamantclearlight
USA
410 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2010 : 8:46:54 PM
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It is the eradication of negative habits.
Adamant |
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mikkiji
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - Jan 18 2010 : 10:30:06 PM
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I was blessed as a young man to study personally for several years with two "Enlightened" beings, one a zen monk named Nippo Sayaku and the other one of the spiritual lights of the 20th century, His Holiness Maharishi Mahesh Yogi. 39 years ago, I asked Roshi Nippo what was the difference before and after Self-Realization, and he told me, "Nothing, no difference at all. Before, we chop wood and carry water, after, still we chop wood and carry water. Only after, it's hard to keep from laughing!", after which he broke into laughter and laughed until the tears were rolling down his cheeks and he was out of breath. I was too ignorant at the time to react with anything but confusion, but I remembered that ever since. After the veils began parting for me, I understood what was so funny--it was, of course, that nothing changed, that there was nothing to realize, no place to travel, no journey to make, nothing to learn or know or understand in order to be fully awake. There was no doing whatsoever, only Being, which had always been omnipresent. It is so obvious, one wonders what seemed so difficult, what was hidden all that time. Enlightenment hides in plain sight in front of your eyes every moment. In Zen, we call Self-realization a passage through the Gateless Gate. Maharishi laughed constantly, not at us poor ignorant seekers, but at the inexplicable nature of ignorance. He once told me that trying to gain enlightenment by addressing one's ignorance is like trying to see in the dark by somehow fixing the darkness, discussing the darkness, holding conferences and studies to research the darkness. All it takes is for someone to find the light switch and turn it on! And our light switch is already within our inner nature. He just helped me to locate my light switch.
As for why it takes a long time... yes, indeed, it often does, but remember--there is nothing else you have to do in life, that is the only goal our only task. Bhakti, the yoga of devotion, can be sufficient to accomplish the task, but I recommend a more wholistic approach, utilizing meditation, the Karma yoga of finding and following dharma, purifying the body through Hatha yoga and utilizing the yamas and niyamas as guides to, as Maharishi recommended to me, "never do what you know to be wrong, and always do what is right."
Namaste,
Michael |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 20 2010 : 08:15:34 AM
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Yesterday I got it. What this is all about. If that's enlightenment or self realisation I don't know.
Just a series of events which made me re-read some of Byron Katies books.
I must have read the same words written and spoken in different ways many times. I have practised meditation, pranayama etc become an NLP practitioner and read more books surrounding therapy and science than I can comfortably fit in a rather large book case.
But it's really so simple and I have no idea why it suddenly pings into place at this moment. Maybe it's a combination of things such as the AYP work and the work with NLP, certainly I would say BK's book was a catalyst (ha, just realised thats my initials turned around.....turnaround!!).
I'm not sure if this really helps anyone, but I may as well broadcast it because somewhere it might be of use.
'Totally accept everything is perfect just as it is'. Once I did that it just made sense. I had just been asleep and a bit insane, busily acting out a part and living my stories.
'know yourself' and that explains it really. Be kind to yourself, learn to love what you are, it isn't difficult because we are all perfect just as we are.
I realised that the monster that used to sleep under the bed had decided to find a new home inside my mind. I had to meet the monster on it's own terms and love it. Once I did, then the nightmare ended and the universe feels like a playground.........the meek shall inherit the Earth  makes far more sense in that context.
That's just the first step, but it was a real biggy. I know there is much, much more and will keep up the effort.
Mikkiji-just read your post I also laughed, there is no monumental change except that you suddenly get connected to yourself.
Why does it seem so stupidly difficult ?? It's not like it is hidden or needs huge effort really, except it seems it does, it's a tiny little change in attitude and the mind goes from being traitor to friend. I just had to know myself on a deep level and marry the two parts together.
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Edited by - karl on Jan 20 2010 08:23:07 AM |
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Shanti
USA
4854 Posts |
Posted - Jan 20 2010 : 08:37:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by karl
'Totally accept everything is perfect just as it is'. Once I did that it just made sense. I had just been asleep and a bit insane, busily acting out a part and living my stories.
 You got it!!!
It is s real slight shift ... but a life changer. I am really happy for you.
quote:
Originally posted by karl
That's just the first step, but it was a real biggy. I know there is much, much more and will keep up the effort.
Actually, this is it. It's just a matter of settling into this deeper and deeper and making it a part of your every day living.
You are right about the effort. You have to put in some effort to remind yourself to accept what it. But it becomes a part of you. I have described my process of doing this here.
Thanks for sharing Karl. Wish you all the best. |
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karl
United Kingdom
1812 Posts |
Posted - Jan 20 2010 : 10:01:44 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Shanti
quote:
Originally posted by karl
'Totally accept everything is perfect just as it is'. Once I did that it just made sense. I had just been asleep and a bit insane, busily acting out a part and living my stories.
You got it!!!
It is s real slight shift ... but a life changer. I am really happy for you.
quote:
Originally posted by karl
That's just the first step, but it was a real biggy. I know there is much, much more and will keep up the effort.
Actually, this is it. It's just a matter of settling into this deeper and deeper and making it a part of your every day living.
You are right about the effort. You have to put in some effort to remind yourself to accept what it. But it becomes a part of you. I have described my process of doing this here.
Thanks for sharing Karl. Wish you all the best.
It's good to know that the process continues.
It's like having a friend in yourself, you still need to put the effort into the union
So, for everyone that has not yet attained self-realisation. Keep at it, do the meditation, read what you need to read and hear, now, what you need to hear.
It will happen, give it time. There will not be a blinding flash, trumpets, or a sudden ascending to an astral plane. You will just feel you are finally home, it will be a small thing, so small as to be invisible and you will say.....'oh yeah, right, that's it. All the fuss and frustration reveals itself as the thing that was always present.
The Guru really is inside you. |
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showup
USA
47 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2010 : 6:31:32 PM
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quote:
God-consciousness... Gnosis....Enlightenment...Self-realization...
God who is called as Paramatman do not have any personality. No personality meaning, no color, shape, texture or smell etc. The pure ‘atman’ present in every living create of this world or other worlds do not have any personality too. The personality of human being and creatures comes when atman joins with maya or ego. As Atman is devoid of personality it takes the personality of maya or ego. So the maya is perceived as human instead of pure atman. It is analogs to a glass which is being colorless but looks in a particular color when a color light passes through it. Enlightment or self realization is the process in which you will be able to separate your Maya or ego from your atman and realize that you are pure atman not the ego.
- Srimad Bhagavad-Gita
quote:
How do you know when you have crossed this line? What are the signs that one has reached this goal?
Once you attained enlightment you will actually see atman in every living being because u learned the technique to separate Maya from pure atman that is in every living being. U will understand human = animal = tree = God, because u r seeing atman in all of them, Not their physical forms or Maya. You will be able to realize and mix with the Paramatman who is no different from you (atman) which is called liberation.
quote:
And why the H does it seem to take so long to get there?
Because U/me the human try to attain the Godly quality. It is highly tough and energy consuming process.
quote:
Can bhakti alone bring you to such a place?
(1) Real hard work (2) Willingness to sacrifice anything and everything (3) Just keep doing the right thing without expecting any thing at all (4) Following the path of ENLIGHTENED Guru who attained jeeva-samathi.
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Edited by - showup on Jan 23 2010 07:07:07 AM |
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Self-realization
