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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 12 2011 : 08:42:56 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Manigma,
quote:
The Universe and the Divine Light are both creations of your mind.
As long as the mind exists, you will keep producing more Universes and bringing Divine Light into them.
Almost. The universe, as we see it, is a creation of the mind, but divine light exists before the mind. Mind, and the universe, which is it's projection, are lower manifestations of that light.
The causal body exists beyond the mind, and is created from divine light. It is created by the light that you are. It is also created by the love that you are.
If you want to spend your time trying to destroy what you are, that is up to you. But when you have finished, remember there is another way.
Christi
I am not trying to destroy myself. I am freeing myself.
I know I am already free. 
And it doesn't really bother me anymore whether I am looking at a Snake or a Rope. Sitting in the Darkness or Light. The Universe is so damn perfect!
Its just really not me who is doing this breaking the mind stuff. Its just happening. And the more I let it happen... the more freedom.
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Christi
United Kingdom
4380 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2011 : 11:09:12 AM
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Hi Manigma,
quote:
I am not trying to destroy myself. I am freeing myself.
I know I am already free.
And it doesn't really bother me anymore whether I am looking at a Snake or a Rope. Sitting in the Darkness or Light. The Universe is so damn perfect!
Its just really not me who is doing this breaking the mind stuff. Its just happening. And the more I let it happen... the more freedom.
It seems to me that you are talking about the mental realm when I am talking about the causal realm. The snake and the rope (form) exist in the mental realm, as does darkness and light (duality). And the separation between self and other ("it's really not me") is also a mental realm phenomenon.
Beyond form, beyond duality, and beyond separation is the causal realm. Beyond the causal realm is Spirit (Brahman). The realization of Spirit happens through the crown chakra and is described in lesson 199.
http://www.aypsite.org/199.html
Christi |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2011 : 11:38:14 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Manigma,
quote:
I am not trying to destroy myself. I am freeing myself.
I know I am already free.
And it doesn't really bother me anymore whether I am looking at a Snake or a Rope. Sitting in the Darkness or Light. The Universe is so damn perfect!
Its just really not me who is doing this breaking the mind stuff. Its just happening. And the more I let it happen... the more freedom.
It seems to me that you are talking about the mental realm when I am talking about the causal realm. The snake and the rope (form) exist in the mental realm, as does darkness and light (duality). And the separation between self and other ("it's really not me") is also a mental realm phenomenon.
Beyond form, beyond duality, and beyond separation is the causal realm. Beyond the causal realm is Spirit (Brahman). The realization of Spirit happens through the crown chakra and is described in lesson 199.
http://www.aypsite.org/199.html
Christi
I am talking about freedom from everything. Duality, Realms, Chakras...
Its the play of energy. And I have played enough.
It was only in the beginning when I was making efforts, that I was passing through some strange experiences; seeing lights, hearing voices, meeting gods and goddesses and conversing with them. Once the Guru told me: 'You are the Supreme Reality', I ceased having visions and trances and became very quiet and simple. I found myself desiring and knowing less and less, until I could say in utter astonishment: 'I know nothing, I want nothing.' - Nisargadatta
Less and less. Beautiful!
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Christi
United Kingdom
4380 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2011 : 11:54:06 AM
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Hi Manigma,
quote:
I am talking about freedom from everything. Duality, Realms, Chakras...
This is Brahman, beyond the causal. It is everywhere and everything and at the same time nowhere and nothing (shunya). The gateway is above the Brahmarundra, which is above the crown chakra.
Then everything dissolves into pure bliss consciousness, and expands into the heart as outpouring divine love. Bliss, because everything is very simple and innocent, and love because everything is connected and whole.
But the playing never stops. Only we do.
Christi |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Jan 12 2011 : 10:05:55 PM
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Hi :)
I just want to mention this. I've never thought that I hit deep silence during the last 3 1/2 years of meditation because I've always seen things, even when there were no apparent thoughts in my mind. I mean, I've had experiences where, after extended meditations, I could see three outlines of my body, just hanging out there in a huge empty dark emptiness that resembled outer-space. But I could always see things so I assumed that it was not the AYP 'deep silence'. Funny that nobody could help me out there.
But then, today, I found this (Sri Ramana):
http://bhagavan-ramana.org/selfenqu...eptions.html
quote:
Of course there is also the practice of meditation on the Heart-centre. It is only a practice and not investigation. Only the one who meditates on the Heart can remain aware when the mind ceases to be active and remains still, whereas those who meditate on other centres cannot be so aware but infer that the mind was still only after it becomes again active.
So, now I believe that it is possible to experience deep silence and be aware of what is occuring, because I've done alot of heart meditations. So maybe I have hit deep silence more often than I've thought. Interesting eh?
:)
TI |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 12:22:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Manigma,
quote:
I am talking about freedom from everything. Duality, Realms, Chakras...
This is Brahman, beyond the causal. It is everywhere and everything and at the same time nowhere and nothing (shunya). The gateway is above the Brahmarundra, which is above the crown chakra.
Then everything dissolves into pure bliss consciousness, and expands into the heart as outpouring divine love. Bliss, because everything is very simple and innocent, and love because everything is connected and whole.
But the playing never stops. Only we do.
Christi
Yes, every Jnani has said this, so it must be true:
This is my favorite explanation:
But, then, again, when the individual becomes a Jnani and when it realises the Infinite Being, the world still exists for the other individuals who have not realised the Truth. Hence the world cannot be the creation of the subjective imagination. It must have an objective reality. Thus, we come to the dilemma that the subjective and the objective aspects of consciousness are both creators as well as not creators of the universe. But the truth seems to be that both are partly true and partly incorrect.
The universe is the production of the collective totality of all the individual minds put together. This totality is termed the cosmic Mind. When the individual realises Brahman, the world vanishes to it, for the nature of Brahman is contrary to that of the world. But the world exists to other individuals even after the Self-realization of an individual, for the world is sustained by the mental forces of the remaining individuals.
Thus the loss of an individual through its Self-realization must effect a great change in the universal force of creativity. The universe is thus the construction of thoughts that are interrelated. Birth and death are of such cause, individuality is due to such reason, as is the nature of the creation of the universe.
~Swami Sivananda
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 12:25:57 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
So, now I believe that it is possible to experience deep silence and be aware of what is occuring, because I've done alot of heart meditations. So maybe I have hit deep silence more often than I've thought. Interesting eh?
Deep Silence is like your whole body is burning with fire and you are crying in pain... but still you are silent.
Its like watching everything (including yourself and your actions/emotions) in 3rd person. This 3rd person is the silent witnesses who just observes. In the body yet severed from it and the mind.
This silence is so deep and thick that nothing can create a ripple over it.
Its like you are aware/conscious yet unconsciously deep asleep.
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Christi
United Kingdom
4380 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 03:14:45 AM
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Hi TI and Manigma,
quote:
Tibetan Ice wrote:
I mean, I've had experiences where, after extended meditations, I could see three outlines of my body, just hanging out there in a huge empty dark emptiness that resembled outer-space. But I could always see things so I assumed that it was not the AYP 'deep silence'. Funny that nobody could help me out there.
quote:
Manigma wrote:
Deep Silence is like your whole body is burning with fire and you are crying in pain... but still you are silent.
I didn't know there was an "AYP deep silence"? Yogani talks about "inner silence", and he calls his meditation practice "Deep Meditation". So you may be mixing the two up. That could be why nobody could help you out there. 
Inner silence is a peculiar thing, and it is the hardest thing to understand. This is because it is not necessarily silent. It can actually be quite loud, or even very loud at times. It can also be absolutely silent at times. It is also not necessarily devoid of images, either physical, or astral, or causal, although at times, it may be.
In it's most basic sense, inner silence is a sense of detachment from the play of what is happening. Sound may be present and sights may be seen, but this detachment gives a sense of "otherness". At first it may feel strange, and then gradually becomes more peaceful and blissful. When this peaceful (witness) state becomes so established that it is not effected by any external or internal condition, then this is said to be savikalpa samadhi. As inner silence deepens, we go beyond the physical, astral and causal and enter a state beyond sight and sound and time. This is full nirvikalpa samadhi.
The highest stage of nirvikalpa samadhi is one where we are fully functional in the world on all levels.
So all of this is inner silence: beginning with the witness, equanimity and discernment, and progressing through surrender, peace and bliss and moving towards wholeness and love.
The last stage (wholeness and love) is only made possible through the rise and expansion of ecstasy within the body and beyond the body. At first this ecstasy can be experienced as if the whole body is burning with fire and there can be pain associated with that. If this is happening it is a sign that we are moving ahead too fast and need to self pace. Gradually, as the nerves (nadis) are purified, the burning sensation changes into one of ecstasy. This happens because the nerve channels of the body are purified enough to take the charge of the higher voltage of prana moving through the body.
So it all has to work together, which is why it is so important to have a balanced and fully integrated system of yoga practices in place. There can be (and often is) a tendency to "go for gold" using one practice or technique. But without a well rounded integral practice system, it can be a long and arduous process. It will work eventually if their is enough will, but it is slow and can be both painful and frustrating along the way.
All the best
Christi
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miguel
Spain
1197 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 04:17:44 AM
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| Thanks for sharing your wisdom christi.It inspires me. |
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 06:12:15 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
So it all has to work together, which is why it is so important to have a balanced and fully integrated system of yoga practices in place. There can be (and often is) a tendency to "go for gold" using one practice or technique. But without a well rounded integral practice system, it can be a long and arduous process. It will work eventually if their is enough will, but it is slow and can be both painful and frustrating along the way.
Yes, the shortcuts can be risky and dangerous. But my Guru (Osho) initiated me to it. He gave me Brahmabhyasa.
Its similar to what was given to Nisargaddatta by his Guru.
And like the spine of all systems, its driven by grace and trust.
The affirmation of Absoluteness is suited only for the highest class of aspirants whose minds are ready to receive the higher spiritual Light. When the Sadhaka practises such severe assertions the physical consciousness will try to revolt against all measures taken against its well-being. The general result of such affirmations by weak-minded aspirants is great fear and shock. The Divine Consciousness tries to manifest itself in the individual and shatters the ego like a mad elephant that has entered a small hut. This supreme meditation is called Brahmabhavana or Brahmabhyasa. The force of intense meditation lights up the entire materialised nature and at once liberates the soul like a sudden flash of lightning. At one stroke the universe dwindles into nothingness and the Majesty of Brahman is revealed. This is the Goal.
~Swami Sivananda
The Grace is always shining like the Sun. Just open the windows... and in flows the light and love.
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 07:04:17 AM
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Manigma,
"The Grace is always shining like the Sun. Just open the windows... and in flows the light and love."
Oh yeah!!!!
Love |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4380 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 09:03:28 AM
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Hi Manigma,
quote:
The affirmation of Absoluteness is suited only for the highest class of aspirants whose minds are ready to receive the higher spiritual Light. When the Sadhaka practises such severe assertions the physical consciousness will try to revolt against all measures taken against its well-being. The general result of such affirmations by weak-minded aspirants is great fear and shock. The Divine Consciousness tries to manifest itself in the individual and shatters the ego like a mad elephant that has entered a small hut. This supreme meditation is called Brahmabhavana or Brahmabhyasa. The force of intense meditation lights up the entire materialised nature and at once liberates the soul like a sudden flash of lightning. At one stroke the universe dwindles into nothingness and the Majesty of Brahman is revealed. This is the Goal.
~Swami Sivananda
Yes, this is exactly what I was talking about. A more balanced practice working with both inner silence and on the purification of the subtle channels, with careful pacing, leads to the same goal, but without the physical and mental pain.
Your call of course.
The quote could be from Krishnananda rather than Sivananda? Krishnananda was one of Sivananda's disciples. It comes from a commentary that Krishnananda wrote to a text written by Sivananda.
Christi
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Jan 13 2011 : 9:37:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Christi
I didn't know there was an "AYP deep silence"? Yogani talks about "inner silence", and he calls his meditation practice "Deep Meditation". So you may be mixing the two up. That could be why nobody could help you out there.
...
Hi Christi :)
Yup, this is my ego coming out now. Thank you for the opportunity to watch it. It is a definate contraction, behind the eyes and progressing towards the back of the head.
There are references to "deep silence" in the AYP lessons. Here are some:
Lesson 20:
quote:
Experiencing the journey naturally unfolding through practices can be more than enough to believe in, once the process has gotten underway and our experiences of deep silence and bliss light the fire of our desire to go for more and more.
Lesson 85:
quote:
The second stage is the rise of ecstasy. This is prana going into a greatly expanded mode of functioning in our nervous system. It is sexual energy going up. It is kundalini. It is also pure bliss consciousness, deep silence, in motion inside us.
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It can make for a very difficult journey trying to do the other things without a firm foundation in deep silence, in pure bliss consciousness.
Lesson 90:
quote:
Anyone who comes to deep silence in meditation feels this expansion also – going in, but also radiating something peaceful out into the physical world.
Lesson 94:
quote:
While meditation is usually a more gentle and blissful process, settling the nervous system down to deep silence and letting obstructions go in a global way, still, powerful experiences can come up in there.
Lesson 139:
quote:
We will be going from high pranic energization to deep silence. Mixing these two is very powerful, and it will be a different kind of experience in meditation.
Lesson 148:
quote:
A: When we do practices, we coax our nervous system into a different style of functioning -- sustaining deep silence (pure bliss consciousness).
Lesson 195:
quote:
That is as still as it gets, and then the inner obstructions dissolve in that state of deep silence in the nervous system. Once the obstructions are going, then the inner silence is with us more and more in daily activity.
But I can see your point. There are 245 references to "inner silence" in the Lessons from 10 to 288. Yikes! I've found a gap!
:)
TI |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4380 Posts |
Posted - Jan 14 2011 : 05:41:15 AM
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Hi TI,
I think these are just 10 places where Yogani is using the phrase "deep silence" as synonymous with "inner silence". Inner silence goes all the way in to nirvikalpa samadhi, so it goes pretty deep. I'm sure Yogani will correct me if I'm wrong about this, and "deep silence" has some special significance in the main lessons.
The quote you found in lesson 195 is a description of full nirvikalpa samadhi which I mentioned above:
quote:
Yogani wrote:
That requires a method of using attention in a particular way with the mantra. If we do, then attention will repeatedly be left standing alone without any objects, including no mantra. That is as still as it gets, and then the inner obstructions dissolve in that state of deep silence in the nervous system. Once the obstructions are going, then the inner silence is with us more and more in daily activity.
Christi |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Feb 06 2011 : 7:32:05 PM
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Hi,
This is an update.
For the past 6 weeks or so this has been my practice, at least twice a day for 35 minutes:
1) Short Prayers
2) Meditation: Abiding in the source of "Who am I" or presence/awareness.
The meditation technique:
Sit in meditation posture, close the eyes, try to sense the feeling of existence and awareness. If something appears, such as a thought, sensation or vision, turn the attention away from it and direct attention to what it is that is perceiving this object: Who is perceiving this thought? Who is it that feels this body sensation? Who is seeing this vision? Who is hearing the tinitus sounds?
As soon as I see a thought, I turn my attention away from it and try to reverse my point of view and abide in what is aware of the thought. I do the same for feelings/sensations and visions or anything that I can perceive. I am trying to abide in the perceiver.
As each meditation progresses the normal stages of going deeper appear: The etheric numby lifeforce is felt in the limbs of the body. Thoughts lessen and lessen. The etheric body and the chakras appear, along with the golden light in the center of the head, and then disappear. A general wave of swooning sensation appears and then the dreamstate appears accompanied by potential dreams and visions. A clear bright shiny liquid like awareness is seen. Then peace, silence, darkness or nothingness and effortlessness..
Again, the game is this: If I can perceive something (such as any and all of the stages listed above), I turn my attention to "who or what is doing to perceiving". I should mention that the turning of attention is effortless, it is not a constriction but a letting go of the object of perception and then sinking back into the feeling that I exist and that I am aware.
Experiences:
Twice I have woken in the middle of the night and heard a strange sound, like a conch blowing or a chord from a synthesizer. It came from the left side of my 'mind'. I've never heard anything like that before..
Last weekend I was lying in bed in the morning after a night's sleep and I was feeling like I was aware but with nothing in my mind. I felt like "I" was just lying there. I was aware that I existed and that I was aware. Then the alarm went off and I witnessed the construction of my 'self'. From the darkness came movement, light and a kind of ball or center appeared that had things/lights/thoughts stuck to it. Then I resumed my normal waking consciousness. Then I realized that I was 'there' before the alarm went off and that I had woken up after the alarm had gone off. In retrospect, I thought I was awake before the alarm went off! I now seem to be abiding in awareness during deep sleep with no dreams.
A few nights later, I was sleeping in bed and I was in deep sleep, no dreams. I was in the same state of being aware of nothing, but knowing that I was alive and aware. Again, I saw the creation of my 'self' appear. But this time there was a reason for it. My body had burped and some acidic fluids had come up into my throat. The strange thing is that it seemed like I watched it happen. My throat constricted, my body started to gag and choke. I thought I was going to choke to death. I sat up in bed, and forced myself to breathe. What an ordeal! I was sweating like crazy and through considerable effort managed to restore my breathing. Then I drank some water, ate a few tums and went back to bed.
Experiences during meditation:
A few times I've seen a huge 'me' that is not limited to the general area of the body or the location of my thoughts. It is bright and shiny and is filled with love. It reminds me of a smiling sky of light. It loves 'me' so much it is kind of embarrassing. I don't think it is the True Self because there was still someone ('me') watching it, but it was interesting nontheless..
Apart from that, the depth of the meditation has increased manyfold. There is considerable silence and thoughtlessness which carries over into the day following the meditations.
I've come to realize that thoughts (and mantras) take you away from the source (unless, of course, you wait for the thought or mantra to dissolve and try to see what it dissolved into, but even then, you can ask yourself, who is perceiving this black space of silence. Is this space only a lack of consciousness while awareness is still present? Probably..). However thoughts and mantras are an excellent tool in the journey towards the source. They are like little signs that say "This is not the way... turn around and go back to who or what is perceiving this sign"..
:)
TI
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bewell
1275 Posts |
Posted - Feb 06 2011 : 8:46:05 PM
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| Thanks for sharing where you are at now. |
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Steve
277 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2011 : 8:54:48 PM
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Hi TI,
Your latest post was very informative and helpful. Sounds like you are making real progress. Congrats. Your sharing is very much appreciated. Please continue.
Love and Light,
Steve |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Feb 09 2011 : 10:41:34 PM
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Hi Bewell and Steve :)
Thanks for your responses. I felt I had to write those experiences down. It helps me to release them and it is good to know that someone else can find some value in them.
So far the only consistent experiences, that I can't deny and never goes away, are 1) The fact that I exist and 2) The fact that I am aware. All other things seem to change..
I've been reading the John Wheeler books. I've finished "Awakening to the Natural State (2004)" and "The Light Behind Consciousness (2008)" and I am starting to read "Right Here, Right Now (2006)".
Here is a taste:
from his pointers at this link: http://www.naturalstate.us/pointers.html
quote:
This is not about being silent. The natural being, your innate nature is always there, doubtlessly present and registering everything. It is just what you are, effortlessly there at all times.
The natural, effortless being and knowing is already present. When that is overlooked, the mind presents an alternate identity in thought, which consists of the "I" notion and all of the self-centered thoughts about that "I".
Your being is always there. Consciousness as a state or experience is coming and going TO your innate, aware existence. Pure being and non-conceptual awareness are one and the same thing. You are that. You are still knowing the coming and going of the state of consciousness or lack of consciousness. That is already happening. That is what you already are.
You are already the pure awareness, but you are overlooking this present fact.
:)
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2011 : 12:21:39 PM
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Hi :)
Time for an update.
I'm still meditating twice a day for 35 minutes each time. My meditation consists of trying to dwell in the "I AM", the feeling that I exist, the part of me that knows, that is still... you could call it awareness/presence.
During the last couple months I've read most of John Wheeler's books, a few books from Sailor Bob Adamson, more of Nisargadatta's writings and a book from Rodney Stevens.
My kundalini is still active. Usually, after meditation there is quite a build-up of enery at the root so, instead of letting it simmer for hours on end (which is very distracting) I will 'pulse' the root muscles a few times and take the energy up my central channel and shoot it out the top of my head. Feels just like a prolonged orgasm or two. Also, the perenium (root) is still my deep silence barometer; whenever my mind pauses or I experience a momentary thought gap, it starts to ache and pulse.
Although I have no great desire to post anything lately, what motivated me to post is this: During a few of my meditations a few months ago when I first started the self-inquiry meditations (dwelling in the perceiver) I went higher up in my mind's eye than I usually do. I was focusing on the things that occur in the periphery that I am effortlessly aware of, like a dog barking, a car driving by.. I was relaxing the mind, expanding my attention upwards and outwards and silently witnessing the fact that even though my attention may be occupied, the majority of objects, forms and events are still effortlessly registering in awareness. I was doing this and then moving my attention backwards from up there to see who was the observer, when I found a stream of light and color that looked like it was a big set of closed transparent lips. This band of colorful transparency was smiling at, loving me, sending me love and joy. It loved me so much I felt embarassed. I didn't make a big deal of this phenomenon, I only wondered if maybe this was some form of manifestation/ishta that was smiling at me, just another form.
So what is the big deal? This morning I found this writing from this link: http://thejohnward.tripod.com/shakti.html
I've bolded the part that hit me like a ton of bricks..
quote:
One great Jnani, said: This 'I am', this 'I amness' is the primary illusion, and the source of the illusion is Shakti Maya. The moment you observe 'I am' begin to manifest you see it is 'the love to be', the state of love of self. We love being, we love our being. It is due to desires contained in the subtle body. The knowledge of 'I am' is the greatest foe, and the greatest friend. Propitiate it properly and it will turn around and lead you to the highest state.
The experiment the jnani is referring to is the attempt to go as high as one possibly can inside one's head. Go up into the higher intellect. Then turn around. Turn completely around so that one is looking at what is behind one. What you see will surprise you. You will see the buddhi, the spiritual body, smiling at you. You may see that you, your nature, the natural body, the jiva, is nothing more than a projection of the buddhi, just like an actor projecting his part in a play. Then you may see very clearly that you do not exist. Further stages of discovery may lead you to the realization that the world is merely a projection of light upon the screen of the mind. Then you know that the whole universe is illusory.
Is that the buddhi? It looks like a chinook arch, transparent yet filled with light pastel colors of pink and blue. It is shiny and luminescent. It resembles a clear slit on the horizon in the cloudy sky of my mind-space, like lips stretched out horizontally. It emits love and joy, too much love and joy! It reminds me of a clown that is almost laughing at me. Like the joke is on me. Strange thoughts, eh?
Has anyone else out there had such an experience?
:)
TI |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Apr 18 2011 : 12:59:25 PM
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I've experienced this state of being before
namaste |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 19 2011 : 10:30:21 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Ananda
I've experienced this state of being before
namaste
Hi Ananda, :)
Good to know. It seems to me in retrospect, that the thing that was evident and probably played a key role in the experience was the fact that as I was going upwards I hit a state where I realized that I didn't know how far I could stretch my mind. It was in this state of not-knowing that the top opened up.
All the best,
TI |
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 19 2011 : 11:17:10 PM
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Hi,
Here is an update.
I've now spent a few months practising the type of meditation where you keep going backwards, trying to focus on "who or what is aware" of the thought, image, sensation etc. On a few days I have gone back to my old routine of pranayama and then mantra repetition just to see what it would do. They are still pretty powerful practices. A few times it overloaded me. But, right now, I am convinced that what the advaitists are saying, that "form cannot be used to grasp non-form" is probably correct. You can't use your mind to grasp presence. As Nisargadatta puts it, the "I AM" comes first, then the mind and the universe are created. You have to go prior to the mind.
I believe I know how to go 'prior to the mind' now.
Quite a few times now since I switched to abiding in the watcher type of meditation, after a full night's sleep I will find myself lying in bed before the alarm clock goes off. I'm just sitting there, everything is dark and silent. There are no thoughts or images or lights. The only thing that exists is that I know that I exist and I can feel that I exist. Then, when the alarm goes off, it is like an explosion of color, light and movement goes off and then I am awake.
I have concluded that this state is the "I AM" that Nisargadatta talks about. It does come before the mind and before consciousness. It is very subtle. But after experiencing it a few times naturally, during the waking stage after a night's sleep, it is getting easier to identify and go back to that state.
For today's morning meditation I decided to go back into that state and resolved to remain there. It is very simple. I just hit the knowledge, the knowing that I exist and at the same time, feel it. I remember the feeling and put myself back into it. The feeling seems to come from somewhere down, behind the body level with the heart, but in another plane or space. I withdraw from everything else, all thoughts, sensations, sounds. It is like this space opens up away from everything but yet it pervades the body and goes behind the body. There seems to be absolutely nothing in that space, perhaps it is a formless space or lack of space.
Anyway, during today's meditation I was successful in abiding in that "I AM" for short periods of time. My body turned into a field of blissfull warmth. The meditation sped right by. I enjoyed it immensely. Silent, dark, dead, no movement, yet warm and alive and mildly blissfull.
So why do I write about it? Well, this state caused my kundalini to become active. I noticed it a little during the meditation when I would pop out for a bit, but afterwards is when it really struck. Over the course of 3 hours after that meditation I experienced 8 or 9 up-the-spine orgasms, intense perineum ache, and waves of goose bumps and shivers coupled with great happiness and joy. I also experienced some pretty strong kriyas. At one point, my right arm jerked so violently that I sent the mouse and keyboard flying! I was just sitting there and my arm and body decided to jerk! I started getting worried about having to function properly during the day but the kriyas kind of dissipated so I wasn't worried for long.
It has been a challenge to finally realize what the "I AM" is. It is the knowledge that I exist accompanied by the feeling that I exist. After that, everything else including mind, consciousness and the universe come into play.
I feel like I am on the brink of something vast.
:)
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - May 22 2011 : 01:36:46 AM
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Hi :)
I had the most amazing experience this morning and I felt I have to write about it.
First off, let me say that I have been doing two 35 minute meditation sessions, regularily, every day, but since two weeks ago, I've also added Jack Kornfield's "Mind Like Sky" meditation from the "Guided Meditation" CD. What I've been doing is hiking out into the bush, by the river, in the evenings. I walk to my favorite bench and then play the meditation on my iphone. It is such a wonderful thing to do, sitting out in the middle of the forest, listening to the sounds, watching the trees and the greenery come alive.
I've never liked guided meditations and quite frankly, have only ever listened to them. I've always thought that one should meditate under one's own steam and that turning control over to the speaker or guide, was somewhat akin to some form of hypnosis. But after listening to this "Mind like Sky" meditation, being so similar to what Tolle had presented by ringing his bell and instructing you to listen intently to it as it died away, leaving a hole of silence, I decided to give it a go. The other point that was driving my decision is the fact that a month or so ago I discovered that even though a person (me) is focusing their attention on something, you are still hearing other sounds effortlessly, all the time. Hence, the field of attention was/is a lot larger than I had spent most of my life assuming. I didn't realize before just how vast attention can be. This guided meditation seemed to develop that aspect of spaciousness of mind.
Anyway, this morning, as I was driving to the store to do some grocery shopping, I was thinking about what I should buy. I thought of three meats to buy, one was a barbecued chicken, the other was steak and the third thing was hamburger so I could make some spaghetti. When these items appeared to me in my mind, they appeared each like a bubble. The first bubble (chicken) appeared in the space of my mind, next the second bubble (steak) appeared to the left of it, and then the third bubble (hamburger) appeared, also to the left of the second bubble. It was strange enough that the thoughts were appearing as rounded bubbles that my mind made a note of it. I noticed the space that the three bubble-thoughts appeared in and I also noticed that there was quite a bit of space between "what was looking at the thoughts" and the bubble-thoughts. At the time I didn't think that much about this, but due to the following experience, I have reconsidered and now consider it significant.
I arrived at the store, obtained a shopping cart and walked to the deli section where I placed my order. As I was waiting for my order to be prepared, I was looking around at the baked goods and produce. The oranges and apples started to shine. Then the air looked very clear. As I moved my gaze around the whole place came alive. The colors were amazing, scintilating, sparkling, shiny. I could see every apple, every orange, each tomatoe, everything in perfect detail! It just blew me away. Then I felt like I was dreaming, that this was a dream and that I was going to wake up. Then I got confused and started vascilating between reality and dream-state, not knowing which was which. I felt like I was truly in a dream. I started to get scared. It was like I no longer had a grasp of what was real and what was not. I made a considerable effort to pull out of this state because I knew I had to pick up my order and keep shopping, but not only that, my mind needed to know that I was not dreaming, that it knew what reality was. My mind needed to regain control.
All in all it was a wonderful experience and I've been reflecting on it all day. I'm a little dissapointed with my mind, for trying to regain control and maintain the common state of affairs. It was a magical experience, a satori state that lasted two or three minutes. I hope that in the future, as I experience more and more of these states I will learn to relax into them and convince my mind that they are ok.
If you have had similar experiences, I would love to hear about them.
:)
TI
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Tibetan_Ice
Canada
758 Posts |
Posted - Jun 15 2011 : 12:38:32 AM
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Hi,
Well here is an update.
I am finished reading all the Advaita books now (John Wheeler, Sailor Bob Adamson, Rodney Stevens, Steven Wingate...) and although I spent many months performing meditations of 'focusing on the feeling of "I AM"', the last book I've read from Nisargadatta has made me change my practices. And although it has been very peaceful and still, meditating on the feeling and knowledge of being, and this has produced more satori moments, I find I am more drawn to practices which cause physical effects..
In one of Nisargadatta's last books, written in 1980 (a year before he passed on), he says this:
quote:
Maharaj: The sum and substance of my teaching is this: Don't be dishonest to your vital breath; worhsip that only, abide in that only, accept it as yourself. And when you worship in this manner, it can lead you anywhere, to any heights -- this is the quintessence of my talks.
Presently, you are to be identified with the vital breath. Then you will realize, like the sweetness in sugar cane, that this touch of "I-am-ness," which is dewlling in the vital breath, will open up. So understand these words, this advice. Assimilate it, and so long as the vital breath is flowing through you, abide in that. if the vital breath is there, you are there and so is Ishwara.
In such simplified fashion, nobody has expounded this profound knowledge.
15 July 1980.
What exactly is the vital breath?
quote:
If you are stabilized in the vital breath as "I am", that in itself will get you there. The vital breath is not confined to the body. All the elements are moved, operated by the vital breath. But because it is inside the body, you call it prana, vital breath. This vital breath itself is a vital energy. And the qualitative principle is the Knowingness that is in the vital force.
I've added bhastrika back to my routine. I find it interesting that most of the time during bhastrika, I can see what appears to be a disc of pale white light a few inches behind the brow. That, and the phenomenon that both nostrils clear right up and a heat is produced in my left nostril, makes me believe that bhastrika is a very powerful pranayama practice.
I've also added Spinal Breathing back to my routine.
I've also been studying pranayama from Sri Swami Sivananda at this link:
http://www.dlshq.org/download/pranayama.pdf
I've also started to incorporate kumbhaka at the end of my bhastrika. I also have a theory that internal kumbhaka stores prana and external kumbhaka stores apana. In order to get heat, you have to mix the two (hence the bandhas). I've been toasty hot on more than once occasion recently.
Another practice I've been experimenting with is the placing of consciousness into each chakra while using the mantra "AUM NAMAH SHIVAYA" as per these instructions:
http://www.hardlight.org/om_namah_shivaya.html
quote:
As you repeat the mantra, be aware of the placement of the syllables. Focus on NA at the root, MA at the second seat, SHI at the navel, VA at the heart and YA at the throat.
And the AUM goes to the brow..
I've tried it with breath control and without. For me, probably because I've done years of "I AM" mantra meditation without breath control, it is more powerful for me than trying to coordinate the breath. I've found this practice to be highly ecstatic. I had no idea how ecstatic it could feel by just mantra-ing a syllable into each of the chakras. Probably an active kundalini helps with all that too..
The last few days (after reading about proper "I AM" meditation technique here on this forum) I have tried to do the "I AM" meditation effortlessly and I end up in a clear coloful space far above my head with lots of visions and things to see. It does not bring me to silence. My question is, if awareness is all-encompassing, even if the mind shuts off, you still see things because you are aware. Don't you?
During Spinal Breathing, the AYP Spinal Breathing, towards the end of the short routine, my body dissolves and I find myself in the sushumna with swirling lights and moving energies. Haven't figured out what to do about that yet. I think it is the "Arising and Passing" phase that Daniel Ingram talks about. I don't want to take it too far though because I end up in this vast dark space, and I become a jelly fish of light. I see no point to that, it is kind of boring, just hanging out there in space looking at the distant stars..
I've also been rereading Dhyan Yogi's books. I'm reviewing the chakras, the powers of the chakras (like the ability of the heart chakra to view long-distance), and the fact that he says once your kundalini is active, you will see visions. In one of his books he sites several devotee's experiences and the visions that they saw once they had shaktipat and experienced kriyas.
So there you have it. Still at it, not enlightened, still searching..
Good luck to you.
:)
TI
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manigma
India
1065 Posts |
Posted - Jun 15 2011 : 05:47:02 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tibetan_Ice
Good luck to you.
LOL.
With the dropping of the primary experience 'I am',
all experiences will vanish and only the Absolute remains.
When this concept 'I am' departs,
there will be no memory left that 'I was' and 'I had' those experiences,
the very memory will be erased.
~Nisargadatta Gita
http://www.stillnessspeaks.com/The_...tta_E-Books/
Good luck to you!
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