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Anthem
1608 Posts |
 Posted - Dec 23 2015 : 10:55:23 PM
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Letting go of knowledge
Have recently come to appreciate the immense price of knowledge. There is no denying that knowledge can of course be incredibly life enhancing at times, as it raises the level of understanding of ourselves and/ or of our physical universe. The insight that knowledge can deliver into our particular life circumstances can be uplifting in a variety of ways. However, as we inadvertently grasp at any good feelings that this increased insight and knowledge can bring to the perceived quality of our lives, we will pay a price with a disconnect from the present moment and a corresponding emotional low to pay for any highs we attach to.
Knowledge can occupy the mind, drawing it up and away from the present moment, which is where we find our interconnectedness to life and to others. Relinquishing our insatiable appetite for knowledge and need to understand the “why” of it all, brings our energy more firmly into the here and now, revealing the mystery of life and synchronicity that can flow into our daily experiences so effortlessly.
We continuously look for our happiness or our satisfaction in some piece of understanding about the way life works, but it never delivers permanently and serves to perpetuate the sense of a self that is solving the problem or finding the “way”.
Can we fall deeply into not knowing, trusting in life and allow it to unfold perfectly as it does, always delivering what we need?
Choosing the present moment and becoming comfortable with not knowing, brings an inner contentedness into our lives, brings us to rest in the realm of the heart as a deep peacefulness pervades our daily lives. Inner peace isn’t found in the highs and lows of life, but in the absence of those where all things come to rest.
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2015 : 12:41:20 AM
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From the Tao Te Ching
CHAPTER 71
In lacking knowledge and desire, one can obtain a simple and honest heart.
The Sage is sick of dishonesty and desire, so he obtains a good and simple heart.
In lacking knowledge, I mean turn away from advancement, and obtain the knowledge of the ways of nature.
Living in harmony with nature, one doesn't need too much knowledge. But there will always be the intellectuals who will think they know.
Simply be at one |
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Ecdyonurus
Switzerland
479 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2015 : 03:18:36 AM
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| I don't think that knowledge is a bad thing, because then ignorance would automatically lead to a better life, more peace, more harmony. But a simple look at some current events on the Earth shows pretty clearly that this is not true. Bad use of false knowledge by uneducated people is much more dangerous than knowledge in itself. Just my opinion. |
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sunyata
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2015 : 07:30:38 AM
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Surrender |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Dec 24 2015 : 08:40:59 AM
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| To have knowledge and to transcend it - perhaps that is the idea? |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2015 : 4:16:42 PM
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Hi BlueRaincoat,
How much knowledge do we want and how much time do we spend pulling it in to our consciousness through the internet, reading books, contemplating life or ourselves etc. instead of being present in the here and now? Would it be in the realm of 80 to 90% a day for most people?
What percentage of the day are we truly present, really listening to others, taking in our surroundings through our senses, helping others, laughing, loving others etc.? Our senses are also a gateway into the present moment. Consciously aware of the feel of standing or sitting, or touching something, or a smell a sound etc.
Being present is true meditation, where all comes to stillness and rest. Life flows and consequently we flow through life in the smoothest way as we give way to not knowing and our sense of well-being finds its home in the contented heart.
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lalow33
USA
966 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2015 : 4:25:16 PM
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Hi Anthem,
With some stages there is desire, maybe other stages less? I don't know. I'm not there. |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2015 : 5:49:58 PM
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Hi Anthem:
This is a classic example of one level of consciousness encouraging others to be at the same level of consciousness while skipping the prerequisite applications of knowledge. This is why we have the lessons on relational and non-relational self-inquiry in AYP.
It is like the guy on the roof who used a ladder to get there, pulling it up behind him and telling everyone how easy it is to get up on the roof without a ladder. Really? 
We'd all like to share our present life experience, but we ought not forget how we got there. Also, to go further ourselves we may find the application of additional knowledge is needed. Knowledge is not the enemy any more than the ego is. Both are tools for awakening, as long as we have them. And when we find don't need them (are not attached) anymore, it does not mean no one else does.
The most important skill a teacher can have is being able to see and advise from the student's perspective. Anyone can teach a nearly awakened (ripe) person how to awaken. But how to teach awakening to everyone -- that is something entirely different, not at all along the lines you are suggesting. It takes some knowledge, applied consistently over time. Only then will we have the luxury of saying that we never needed the means in the first place, and neither does anyone else. Sorry, it does not work like that. It would be nice if it did. 
The guru is in you.
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Dogboy
USA
2201 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2015 : 8:14:23 PM
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| I am grateful for ladders. |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Dec 25 2015 : 9:04:04 PM
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Just to springboard off Yogani's comments, let me sprinkle in a little Whitman:
And I said to my spirit: "When we become the enfolders of those orbs, and the pleasure and knowledge of everything in them, shall we be filled and satisfied then?
And my spirit said: "No, we but level that lift to pass and continue beyond."
In other words, we have barely scratched the surface here. There are treasure troves of knowledge and experience yet to be had, and it's all for us. The thing about the present moment is that it keeps moving. To honor the present moment is to look forward to what the future can bring. Many people misunderstand that fine point. We can look backward, we can look ahead, and still be in the present moment (extreme polarities and imbalances notwithstanding).
There is no present moment without the past and future. You cannot segregate or divorce this trinity within spacetime. It's a full-package deal beyond division or negotiation. |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2015 : 09:28:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by lalow33
Hi Anthem,
With some stages there is desire, maybe other stages less? I don't know. I'm not there.
Hi Lalow,
Yes for sure there is desire, but being aware of the price of things we play with in duality help us choose what we really want. If we know the the price of indulging in certain things, it becomes easier to let go. For example, if we become aware of the harm that smoking cigarettes can cause the body, it is easier to let go of the addiction.
It's all about balance. :)
All the best! |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2015 : 3:00:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Hi Anthem:
This is a classic example of one level of consciousness encouraging others to be at the same level of consciousness while skipping the prerequisite applications of knowledge.
Are you sure about that? I don’t see this concern as relevant here. In my experience, being aware there is a price for knowledge, (despite how good it feels to acquire it) and finding a better balance between indulging continuously in knowledge and being present can be helpful to anyone.
quote:
It is like the guy on the roof who used a ladder to get there, pulling it up behind him and telling everyone how easy it is to get up on the roof without a ladder. Really?
It’s certainly not easy to overcome our addictions, but being aware of them is the first step.
We'd all like to share our present life experience, but we ought not forget how we got there.
Not forgetting, just seeing different things that help balance to be achieved and sharing them. They aren't the only methods, they aren't be all/ end all methods, just some simple things people can use if it suits them, (or not).
quote:
Also, to go further ourselves we may find the application of additional knowledge is needed. Knowledge is not the enemy any more than the ego is. Both are tools for awakening, as long as we have them. And when we find don't need them (are not attached) anymore, it does not mean no one else does.
No argument that knowledge can be helpful at times, but we are talking about over indulgence and addiction to it in this thread. Balance is the aim and letting go of the overindulgence will lead to more time being present and precipitate greater emotional stability.
quote:
The most important skill a teacher can have is being able to see and advise from the student's perspective.
Yes I agree, this is critical for effective one on one teaching, when you are teaching groups, this dynamic slows and you move at the pace of the group as whole.
quote:
Anyone can teach a nearly awakened (ripe) person how to awaken. But how to teach awakening to everyone -- that is something entirely different, not at all along the lines you are suggesting.
I’m not here to teach awakening to everyone, just sharing observations from along the way that can be helpful to others or not?
It’s for anyone reading to determine if they connect to whatever they read or if it works for them or not.
However this said, suggesting that people use typical mindful methods like bringing the mind to the present moment, or use the senses to engage more consciously in the present moment is hardly controversial and generally regarded as time tested methods for awakening further I think it’s safe to say.
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parvati9
USA
587 Posts |
Posted - Dec 26 2015 : 4:31:29 PM
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My path has led me to this point. All of life has a flavor of slightly intriguing. The sattva, rajas, tamas - all of it - slightly intriguing. Something apparently has got to be burned through. Addiction to anything is a trap ... unless that something is one's true Self. And one's true Self is always and forever. Bedrock. Being present in the moment is genuinely worthwhile. Comforting unless there is work to be done i.e., being present with the discomfort. If one must be addicted to something, let that something be the present moment ... as the revealer of our authenticity.
But here's the question brought up in OP: What of all that time spent avoiding the present? Intently pursuing something - perhaps knowledge or enlightenment - in a rajasic way. Or thoroughly confused, in pain or delusion - tamas. What of those times? Suppose we can acknowledge the price of not being present (due to pain or distraction)? We are okay with paying whatever price is required. Partly because we trust enough to be willing to open to all of it. And partly because we haven't the ability yet to open to all of it. Even as remaining present feels like returning home, we still take small side trips, excursions away from home. And gradually the difference clarifies. Then there may be less and less fascination with leaving home.
This however is undoubtedly a delicate process which takes the time it takes. Time to which the wise ones reconcile themselves. No matter how long it takes, or what it takes.
At some point we lose patience with trying to understand, feeling it necessary to somehow go beyond wherever our minds can take us. Yet there is infinite patience for simply being present. We are willing to go through whatever is required in order to allow ourselves to be ... to unlearn everything but that. And just being, we accept (or trust) whatever may come along.
Not that it's perfect. But it is the only way it can be. Somehow we find contentment in that. And it is enough.
love
parvati |
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The human addiction to knowledge
