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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 09 2008 : 2:57:04 PM
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Hi All,
Just one quick question:
If one is using the Tantra "training wheels" method of "blocking" ejaculation, are there any warnings to go along with this practice? Is it safe to use this method regularly? Does this not lead to what is classically called in Western culture: "Blue Balls"? Just a question, not really concerned, just curious. Thanks for any thoughts.
In Love,
CarsonZi |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Sep 10 2008 2:57:17 PM |
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sushman
India
86 Posts |
Posted - Sep 10 2008 : 2:50:10 PM
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| I also have a similar question on tantric masturbation. Doing masturbation regularly (daily or so) without ejaculating - will it lead to any physical problems? |
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anthony574
USA
549 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2008 : 5:01:32 PM
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| I used the perineum press for a while to try to acheiev non-ejaculatory orgasm. What actually happened was I thought I had found a way to still be able to masturbate to the addictive mental imagery I retained from years of being a typical Western teenager without losing semen so I ended using the perineum press quite a bit. Not long after I developed a cyst in my scrotum that I believe it attached to the epidymus and although it is not 100% comfirmed by doctors (what is?) they think it is a spermatocele which is a pocket of dead sperm that developes in the spermatic vessels. I personally think this happened as a result of using mechanical blockage. Abstaining from orgasm is better and honestly if you slip over the edge just let it happen. It is not going to "ruin your kundalini" and it actually gives you a good opportunity to observe the physiological process of orgasm (ie the different pumps and involuntary reflexes) which can aid in achieveing non ejaculatory orgasms that DO NOT require mechanical interference. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2008 : 5:13:44 PM
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Thanks Anthony! Very helpful! I had an inclination that using the "blocking" method could lead to some physical issues, and have done what I can to only use it in the most dire of situations. (which is to say very rarely) Thanks for reminding me too that the blocking method is just "training wheels" and it is much better to abstain from orgasm then to block orgasm. I was just hoping to hear if this method had led to any problems with other practitioners, more out of curiousity then out of fear of hurting myself. I'm sure using the blocking method once in a while can't be of too much harm. Thanks for your input!
In Love,
CarsonZi |
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YogaIsLife
641 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2008 : 6:11:16 PM
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Thank you so much for this thread. I had the same question and was going to post soon about it.  |
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anthony574
USA
549 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2008 : 7:51:47 PM
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I think also that as an absolute last resort one could use this method with no harm.
I am speaking from a novice standpoint as I have only practiced AYP for about a year and a half. I have found that it is easy to become fixated on ejaculatory abstinence as a magic key to kundalini...but it doesn't seem so from personal experience and reading the boards. It seems to me that Yogani has a relaxed opinion about ejaculation and in his teachings he says something to the effect that one could ejaculate once a week with little to no effect on energy. A lot of it is in your head. I think it is best not to demonize ejaculation.
Like I said, if it comes it comes :-) |
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Scott
USA
969 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2008 : 10:58:54 PM
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Anthony,
Great advice. I agree wholeheartedly. |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Sep 16 2008 : 01:25:37 AM
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| What are all different blocking techniques are we talking here ? |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Sep 16 2008 : 11:05:58 AM
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The only blocking technique we are talking about here Albert is pressing two fingers into the perinium at the time of ejaculation as it will keep the ejaculate from actually leaving the body.
And I too agree with you Anthony....I think we would do well to not demonize ANYTHING, not just ejaculating
In Love,
CarsonZi |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Sep 16 2008 : 9:44:04 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by CarsonZi
The only blocking technique we are talking about here Albert is pressing two fingers into the perinium at the time of ejaculation as it will keep the ejaculate from actually leaving the body.
Ok I understand more the thread. Personnally, i've never used that blocking technique but rather use deep breathing, tongue touching the roof of my mouth, eyes looking up & relaxing while maintaining high arousal.
In fact, i've recently discovered it is possible to self-heal deep samskaras by actually ejaculating along energy rushes generated by tantric orgasm. In other words, once you have been initiated to non-ejaculatory orgasm, it opens new pathways then other pathways might be open more through energy-rush-ejaculation. It might be a form of grounding more while having higher levels of shakti-kundalini flowing through our vessel hence no loss of energy at all.
Albert |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4373 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 07:17:23 AM
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Hi Anthony,
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I used the perineum press for a while to try to acheiev non-ejaculatory orgasm. What actually happened was I thought I had found a way to still be able to masturbate to the addictive mental imagery I retained from years of being a typical Western teenager without losing semen so I ended using the perineum press quite a bit. Not long after I developed a cyst in my scrotum that I believe it attached to the epidymus and although it is not 100% comfirmed by doctors (what is?) they think it is a spermatocele which is a pocket of dead sperm that developes in the spermatic vessels. I personally think this happened as a result of using mechanical blockage. Abstaining from orgasm is better and honestly if you slip over the edge just let it happen. It is not going to "ruin your kundalini" and it actually gives you a good opportunity to observe the physiological process of orgasm (ie the different pumps and involuntary reflexes) which can aid in achieveing non ejaculatory orgasms that DO NOT require mechanical interference.
I am sorry to hear about the medical problems you have been having with your testes. Just to let you (and everyone else) know, the blocking technique does not cause semen to be retained in the testicles. Instead it re-directs the flow of semen into the bladder. From there it is usually released from the body during urination. For this reason I doubt that using the blocking technique contributed to your medical problem.
quote:
It seems to me that Yogani has a relaxed opinion about ejaculation and in his teachings he says something to the effect that one could ejaculate once a week with little to no effect on energy. A lot of it is in your head. I think it is best not to demonize ejaculation.
I believe that when Yogani did say that the blocking technique also involves an energy loss, and should only be used as a last resort, but that using it no more than once a week would not seriously harm spiritual progress. I don't believe he has said the same about ejaculatory orgasm. Maybe he will chime in to clarify his position on this.
Christi |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 07:50:55 AM
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Hi All:
I concur with Christi's comments, with one addition. As ecstatic conductivity is awakened and advances, sexual essences are absorbed increasingly upward through the bladder as part of the corresponding higher neurobiological functioning (natural vajroli), even when there is no external sexual stimulation. In the case of blocking in this situation, only part of the semen will be expelled during urination, due to the constant upward absorption of sexual essences, and depending on how much time passes until urination after blocking.
I have been using blocking for about 25 years with no adverse health effects. Just the opposite. That is why it is in the lessons, and why it has been called "poor man's vajroli." It gets the job done.
Note: Tantric sexual methods work best in conjunction with a daily routine of sitting practices, including deep meditation, spinal breathing, etc. Without these, all bets are off on the effectiveness of tantric sexual methods.
The guru is in you.
PS: As discussed in the tantra lessons and elsewhere in the forums, I believe simple blocking is superior to the much-ballyhooed method of mechanical vajroli. Why develop an elaborate strategy for getting the horse back in the barn when we have a perfectly good strategy for keeping him in the barn in the first place? In any case, neither of these methods are the primary cause of natural vajroli. Sitting practices are the primary cause of natural vajroli, which is a component of the awakening of ecstatic conductivity and radiance (kundalini).
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YogaIsLife
641 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 08:43:09 AM
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Hi,
Very interesting discussion and enlightening. I have one question regarding blocking: where exactly do you block? I have experimented with it a little bit but don't know exactly where to press and how hard to press. I understand the base of the penis goes until the medium of the perinieum (the space between sexual organ and anus) and then it goes up into the body. Where exactly do we block? And what's the ammount of force one should use? I never blocked an orgasm yet but tried while in a pre-orgasmic excited state to see if I could feel sexual essences going up and still am not sure. As I press in the middle sometimes it seems the erection does go down and some ecstacy up. Is this a good sign? |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 08:47:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by yogani
PS: As discussed in the tantra lessons and elsewhere in the forums, I believe simple blocking is superior to the much-ballyhooed method of mechanical vajroli. Why develop an elaborate strategy for getting the horse back in the barn when we have a perfectly good strategy for keeping him in the barn in the first place? In any case, neither of these methods are the primary cause of natural vajroli.
Hello Yogani,
i'm lost again with the label blocking used in many sentences in this thread, maybe it is the langage barrier
For example, what is here simple blocking as opposed to mechanical vajroli ?
Another question, what is natural vajroli ?
Sorry, Albert |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 09:14:38 AM
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Hi Albert:
Blocking or simple blocking (same thing): http://www.aypsite.org/T5.html (plus related AYP tantra lessons) Note: It is pressing and blocking the urethra against the back side of the pubic bone during ejaculation.
Mechanical vajroli: an ancient method of sucking fluid up the urethra into the bladder. See the Hatha Yoga Pradipika.
Natural vajroli: automatic and ongoing uptake of sexual essences into the bladder and beyond, an aspect of rising ecstatic conductivity. A natural result of sitting practices in both men and women.
The guru is in you.
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Sep 17 2008 : 10:20:21 AM
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Thanks everyone for the information, very helpful/enlightening.
Yogaislife: The correct spot to push is in roughly the same spot you push on with your heel while sitting in sidhasana. In my experience there is a fairly broad range of area that can be pushed upon to acheive the blocking effect. I have pushed as far back as just in front of the anus, and as far forward as just below the base of the testes. It works just as well (in my experience) in any area. The more important thing I think is the pressure, although it is very easy to get the pressure right. If you don't push hard enough semen will start to leak out of the penis. And if you push too hard I bet it hurts. (haven't pushed that hard, but I can assume that is what would happen) It is pretty easy to get the hang of, just gotta experiment a little. (darn)
In Love,
CarsonZi |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Sep 17 2008 11:26:26 AM |
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selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2008 : 02:56:40 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Natural vajroli: automatic and ongoing uptake of sexual essences into the bladder and beyond, an aspect of rising ecstatic conductivity. A natural result of sitting practices in both men and women.
Thx for your clarification Yogani.
One last question, do you consider my practice of PC muscle self-locking, using deep breathing, tongue touching the roof of my mouth, eyes looking up to have energy go up & relaxing while maintaining high arousal to be a Natural vajroli ?
In Shakti, Albert |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2008 : 07:40:27 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by selfonlypath
quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Natural vajroli: automatic and ongoing uptake of sexual essences into the bladder and beyond, an aspect of rising ecstatic conductivity. A natural result of sitting practices in both men and women.
Thx for your clarification Yogani.
One last question, do you consider my practice of PC muscle self-locking, using deep breathing, tongue touching the roof of my mouth, eyes looking up to have energy go up & relaxing while maintaining high arousal to be a Natural vajroli ?
In Shakti, Albert
Hi Albert:
Pranayama, mudras and bandhas (basically what you are describing) are part of what cultivate natural vajroli, along with deep meditation, samyama, etc. You will know it is becoming natural vajroli when "whole body mudra" begins to happen, without external sexual stimulation. That is when the internal movements become automatic and very small (micro), and there are ecstatic waves coursing through the body, and beyond. This is the rise of ecstatic conductivity and radiance. It is a second puberty, an awakening. From here, our life gradually transforms to become stillness in action, non-duality in the field of duality -- outpouring divine love...
All of this is in the lessons, from many more angles than I can cover here.
The guru is in you.
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mikkiji
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2008 : 10:53:58 AM
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I sort of "discovered" the basic "blocking" technique by myself, over 40 years ago, when I was maybe 14 years old. I can't exactly recall how I discovered it, but as a young teen, it was very handy for not making messes in bed or needing wads of tissues! So, I regularly used it from the age of about 14 onward during nearly 100% of my self-pleasuring. I continued to use it during masturbation after I became sexually active, into and during my marriage, and after widowhood, so I suppose I have even more experience with it than Yogani has! Since remarriage, I have not used it because it has become unnecessary. I have had no physical repercussions or effects caused by my 40+ years of blocking semen release during orgasm, and must agree with Yogani, that in fact, it has gradually over the decades enabled me to experience greater and greater degrees of ecstasy during orgasm while actually causing less and less loss of energy--and this is my understanding of how that works internally. The semen gets redirected internally into the bladder. Now, normally, especially if I masturbated right before bed, the semen released into the bladder, during the hours of sleep, will largely be reabsorbed by the body instead of being released in the urine. Of course, this has all been in conjunction with 35+ years of twice-daily sitting meditation, so this does not occur in a vacuum. I REALLY like your description of the rise of ecstatic conductivity and radiance as a "second puberty", Yogani--that's exactly how it feels in so many ways! In fact, my new wife and I have many times remarked after lovemaking how we feel so much like teenagers lately! And the transformation of life itself so naturally flows from that...
Michael |
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Can you hurt yourself with "Blocking" technique?
