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 Discussions on AYP Pranayama, Mudras and Bandhas
 Spinal breathing without bandhas and mudras??
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anthony574

USA
549 Posts

Posted - Aug 23 2007 :  2:23:46 PM  Show Profile  Visit anthony574's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Message
Hello.

I have been doing AYP for about 5-6 months. I have done SB since the beginning but without mudras or bandhas. After a while I started meditating and doing pranayama with Siddhasana, which i find to be comfortable. I have read yogani's books and was interested in trying some of the independent ones (chin pump, ect) but i always see they require the use of mulabandha, ect. i figured i would just slowly integreate them into my pranayama and down the road try chin pump or something.

i tried doing mulabandha today and felt it was a disaster. i am well aware of my PC muscle being a guy, but find when i contract my sphincter and draw the perineum muscle upward it causes my abs to contract. now i understand this is another bandha...but how can i take deep breaths if i cant extend my stomach the whole time? also, with mulabandha i find the contraction weakens and i have to keep recontracting it. i found the whole thing to be very distracting and being that i do not feel ecstactic conductivity, i think maybe i shouldnt do them now.

my question is whether it is OK to do SB without mudras and bandhas, or maybe because i dont use them could that be the reason i have never felt the energy? is it possible to reach ecstatic conductivity first and THEN incorporate bandhas and mudras?

thanks for the help guys!

Kyman

530 Posts

Posted - Aug 23 2007 :  4:11:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit Kyman's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hey anthony,

The muscles can do the work for you, just awaken them with stimulation. Once they have some strength, the kundalini will flow through the nerves in the muscles, causing it to contract with a perfect flow. The contraction rides the flow, and the flow travels through the body, which is what moves us into auto positions.

When you do normal breathing, after 10 minutes, observe the motion of the diaphragm. Observe how it controls the breath. Notice how you squeeze the stomach to expel air, and the head tends to look down. Then when you inhale, the chest expands, back arches, and the head tends to look up. Try toning your muscles, then do meditation and deep breathing. Watch how the muscles respond better than they ever did before.

Bravo on the deep meditation, without that you could have tough time tying everything together later. You could even lose steam, or not understand what everything amounts too. The inner stillness connects all, by removing obstructions we allow it to permeate our body. Stillness isn't just a state of mind, it can be felt in the body.

I reached ecstatic conductivity first in meditation, this was before I came to AYP. At the time I didn't really know what was happening, but I could tell that if I bent my body in certain ways I could circulate the energy through my body. Then I found a site on spinal breathing and realized what I had been doing.

Edited by - Kyman on Aug 23 2007 4:16:20 PM
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zzzMonster

Singapore
38 Posts

Posted - Aug 26 2007 :  06:35:23 AM  Show Profile  Visit zzzMonster's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
HI anthony574, I dont have the same feeling as you. I instead have the same feeling as Kyman. Maybe it is because you did Siddhasana before Mulabandha. Dont worry about the stomach expanding,just follow the tube in the spine.

Btw,I hijack your thread a bit,somethings during paranayama,my head tilts to 1 side and I cannot follow the tube up my neck,what should I do ?
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Anthem

1608 Posts

Posted - Aug 26 2007 :  11:21:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply

quote:
i tried doing mulabandha today and felt it was a disaster. i am well aware of my PC muscle being a guy, but find when i contract my sphincter and draw the perineum muscle upward it causes my abs to contract. now i understand this is another bandha...but how can i take deep breaths if i cant extend my stomach the whole time? also, with mulabandha i find the contraction weakens and i have to keep recontracting it. i found the whole thing to be very distracting and being that i do not feel ecstactic conductivity, i think maybe i shouldnt do them now.

Hi Anthony,

Sounds like you are maybe using too much exertion. It is meant to be a very subtle and gentle pulling up sensation, not like something that you might do in the gym. Keeping this in mind will make mulabandha less distracting and help it integrate more smoothly into your routine.
quote:

my question is whether it is OK to do SB without mudras and bandhas, or maybe because i dont use them could that be the reason i have never felt the energy?

It is perfectly ok to do SB without mudras and bandhas though having said that, using them (I believe) will encourage your nervous system to open up more quickly over the long-run.
quote:
is it possible to reach ecstatic conductivity first and THEN incorporate bandhas and mudras?

Yes, this is how it went for me.

The best thing I could say about the inner energies is to not give them any thought. They will come when they come and worrying about it simply causes unnecessary tension. In fact, it is almost a favour in some ways when they are not there, in that the effectiveness of your practices will not be diminished by any distractions that experiences can bring about.
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Anthem

1608 Posts

Posted - Aug 26 2007 :  11:40:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by zzzMonster


Btw,I hijack your thread a bit,somethings during paranayama,my head tilts to 1 side and I cannot follow the tube up my neck,what should I do ?


Hi zzzMonster,

Not sure I understand why you can't follow the spinal nerve just because your head is tilting? If you can, I would suggest forgetting any movements your body may or may not make during spinal breathing and continuously bringing your attention back to tracing the spinal nerve when you notice it doing otherwise as outlined in the lessons.

I personally would place more emphasis on feeling the spinal nerve physically, as I trace it, rather than visualizing it. Having said that though, over time, feeling it and seeing it do go hand in hand.

Good luck,

A
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anthony574

USA
549 Posts

Posted - Aug 26 2007 :  6:24:46 PM  Show Profile  Visit anthony574's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Well, I notice with mulabandha I can contract the anus, contract the perineum, and then pull the periduem up into my abdomen. I am not sure which of these three to do. Pulling it up is too distracting and I don't think the average person could hold that for 10 mins. Even some of the most demanding tantric exercises ive seen dont tell you to hold it for 10 mins!
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SuperTrouper

USA
49 Posts

Posted - Aug 30 2007 :  11:52:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
When I first started doing mulabandha, it was difficult because the muscles weren't conditioned to respond on command. They contracted only during sexual activities. Most of my concentration left the practice the first few sessions and focused mostly on maintaining this. But eventually, as I became more familiar with it and could hold it automatically with an initial command, I could leave it and practice the meditation technique. If you hold it for more than a few seconds, you'll probably have to re-tighten it if the awareness comes upon it again and sees it has slackened. No biggie. As for doing just the perineum, just the sphincter, or the muscles between the sphincter and the coccyx... I just do them all, it's easiest that way. You will find a difference after awhile in practicing meditation with bandhas and without them. Also, any new ancillary practice you go through, you're likely to deal with the same initial issues -- it doesn't flow perfectly smoothly with the meditation when first integrated and takes some time to perfectly incorporate so your awareness can leave it and go back to the meditation.

Just my experience talking. Everyone's somewhat different, though.
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yogani

USA
5192 Posts

Posted - Aug 30 2007 :  12:16:56 PM  Show Profile  Visit yogani's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Anthony:

Keep in mind that nearly all practices have a "clunky stage" at the beginning. Everything smooths out in time.

Also check these two lessons, and others listed in the topic index under "mulabandha/asvini."

Hitting a wall at mulabandha -- http://www.aypsite.org/105.html

Some other approaches to mulabandha -- http://www.aypsite.org/119.html

And, yes, spinal breathing pranayama is fine without mudras and bandhas, until you are ready for something more. Ecstatic conductivity may come before, during or after. There is no telling. Ecstasy is a symptom of purification (the friction of energy moving through purifying neurobiology) that may fluctuate up and down over many years before it becomes very refined, steady and radiant. Inner silence is the prerequisite -- so deep meditation is primary. Take it one step at a time, balancing your bhakti (spiritual desire) with your good common sense. Self-pacing!

All the best!

The guru is in you.
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