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 Jnana Yoga/Self-Inquiry - Advaita (Non-Duality)
 completely letting go
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interpaul

USA
281 Posts

Posted - Apr 29 2021 :  1:14:05 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Message
I have recently noticed a subtle but powerful change during my samayama practice. I have finally after a year of releasing the sutras into silence been able to release them without any holding on to the word or controlling the process. I play minecraft with my son and realized there was an analogy in this. It's a game where you smash the ground and the earth lots of rocks end up in an equivalent of a backpack. The only way to proceed with the game once your backpack fills up is to let go of these rocks (attachments). If you walk over to a lake or a lava bed and drop the rocks, they clear up space for you to progress in your journey. When I now release the sutras into silence, I can just let them go like dropping the rocks. This may not seem like much to those who don't have control issues but it seems signifiant to me. The reason I am posting this in the self inquiry section is it made me wonder who is that guy releasing the thoughts and who or what are these being released into? Does the process of surrender, i.e. releasing all control over this action somehow negate "me". If I am no longer in control of the process who/what is in control?

kumar ul islam

United Kingdom
775 Posts

Posted - Apr 29 2021 :  3:35:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
the light of ones own mind flashes through the past and shines through the present ,a continual reflection movement ,control is another construct ,becoming accustomed to seeing the process or awareness of, becomes the next level parameter we give ourselves until another horizon of the self appears layer upon layer understanding upon understanding ,the guy is all these things we drop the rocks because they longer matter but are still part of us but only when we see them hence the quote the light of one own mind flashes through the past and illuminates the present .
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Yogabuzz108

United Kingdom
30 Posts

Posted - May 15 2021 :  8:15:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Om interpaul,

You are the rocks, you are the back pack that holds the rocks, you are the one holding them, and you are the one releasing them, you are the creator of all these things and as such they are holding you here... I'm sorry if this sounds like a ****y answer, but your question lays within the plane of duality, so there will never be a straight forward answer, its based in separation. Physics and science states that everything in the infinite universe exploded from a point smaller than an atom of infinite energy, everything that exists within the universe has all come from that same point, so if we think about it like this, separation is a ludicrous belief, so where does this idea of separation come from, well it comes from the mind, which only exists on the material plane.

The manifest universe lays in the plane of duality, ie. the 3d world, up, down, left right, back, forward, this creates 3 axis 3d, it also creates polar opposites, Male, female etc. and we are always seeking to become balanced hence why Male/Female relationships are so very common,

Basically I think what I am trying to say is that, let go of everything, you won't lose yourself, rather all you will lose is the idea of separation (mind), we all came from that same infinitesimally small point of infinity energy in infinite stillness, all that happens when we let go, is letting go of the mind which is a product of the manifest universe, I promise you you won't disappear or become nothing, rather, by letting go you will become everything, when we identify with nothing we become everything

By forgetting, we remember

Edited by - Yogabuzz108 on May 15 2021 11:46:27 PM
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kumar ul islam

United Kingdom
775 Posts

Posted - May 16 2021 :  4:13:46 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
By forgetting we remember by letting go you become everything
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interpaul

USA
281 Posts

Posted - May 17 2021 :  2:55:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Yogabuzz108, Thanks for your perspective. I realize my questions and insights mostly come from the world of duality, a world I've lived in for 50 plus years. I get glimpses of a non dualistic perspective during meditation but I do live mostly in a dual world with bills and garbage to deal with. These conceptual realms come to crashing stop if I don't engage in the dualistic reality in which I engage daily.

Kumar ul islam, Your insights seem to flow from a non dual state. I would love to know a person like you in real life to see how one can function from within this space. Hopefully my samyama practices will slowly spill over into my daily life.
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kumar ul islam

United Kingdom
775 Posts

Posted - May 18 2021 :  12:59:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
hi paul i dont really think there is a non dual or dual state but many or infinite states continually moving growing dieing ,practice of anykind reveals the many states to us we then become accustomed or familiar , ,stop practicing one thing and start another the state changes action equals consequence in silence we illuminate a portion of reality for that moving moment we grow or add, change,
A poetic zen phrase saying
on the tips of a thousand grasses
each and every dewdrop contains the light of the moon
since the beginning of time
not a single droplet has been forgotten
although this is so
some may realize it .and some may not .

all is dual and nondual at the same time and both exist and dont exist ,we are awake ,we sleep ,we dream ,all at the same time ,and paul we already know each other in everything we touch see hear and sense at moments we live this at others we dont.
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Dogboy

USA
1848 Posts

Posted - May 18 2021 :  9:01:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Samyama will help for sure. I truly believe in the intention to marry the inside and outside. One way to do this, if in bliss or energetic outside of your AYP practice, is to intentionally keep your eyes open and enjoy the overlap.
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Yogabuzz108

United Kingdom
30 Posts

Posted - May 30 2021 :  12:18:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply

Om interpaul,

Apologies for mentioning duality, it was not appropriate for me to do so ((((on this occasion) not that I have ever really talked about it anywhere before) it was my ego exposing itself) and we all have one) or we wouldn't be 'here') no matter how deep we go (or how free we think we are from our attachments) they keep popping up))) we are all present in the manifest universe (duality), and we are here for reasons, but we are aware of something that is not subject to fluctuation (duality), hence why we are practicing yoga, we know there is something more than what we are currently experiencing.

And yes, sometimes we will lose ourselves into a place where none of this matters, but as you have noticed, this is just escapism (if we are not paying our bills etc.) but it is possible and very much within our grasp, to be there and here at the same time, we don't have to be one or the other; this ability is cultivated through not wanting (to be one or the other), this is what they are talking about when they say 'practice with non attachment', which sounds like a bizarre concept, because if we didn't want something (more), we wouldn't be practicing in the first place, but the yo-yoing of being there and here serves the purpose of showing us that as long as we want one state, we are actually identifying ourselves as something separate (different) from the very thing that we want, if we want, we are actualizing separation, rather, know that you are already the thing you desire, be the thing that you desire, and you will become it, if we want, we see what we don't have, we become absent of the (very) thing we want because we see it as separate from us (duality), separate from the object of desire, when in actuality you are already the object of your desire, you are already everything, you have just forgotten is all.

I don't know if any of this makes sense, or if it is of interest, its just what came out, discard, delete or erase this message, I don't teach, but sometimes I share. I take no possession of these words, nor their outcome, (as I'm sure they've all been spoken before (but maybe not in that order haha)).

I love.

Gods speed.
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Christi

United Kingdom
3880 Posts

Posted - May 30 2021 :  1:18:47 PM  Show Profile  Visit Christi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by interpaul

I have recently noticed a subtle but powerful change during my samayama practice. I have finally after a year of releasing the sutras into silence been able to release them without any holding on to the word or controlling the process. I play minecraft with my son and realized there was an analogy in this. It's a game where you smash the ground and the earth lots of rocks end up in an equivalent of a backpack. The only way to proceed with the game once your backpack fills up is to let go of these rocks (attachments). If you walk over to a lake or a lava bed and drop the rocks, they clear up space for you to progress in your journey. When I now release the sutras into silence, I can just let them go like dropping the rocks. This may not seem like much to those who don't have control issues but it seems signifiant to me. The reason I am posting this in the self inquiry section is it made me wonder who is that guy releasing the thoughts and who or what are these being released into? Does the process of surrender, i.e. releasing all control over this action somehow negate "me". If I am no longer in control of the process who/what is in control?



This is a useful form of self-inquiry and is something that you could use during self-inquiry outside of practices. So, during samyama, the sutras are simply released into silence, with no inquiry as to who is doing the releasing. But during the day, if you are using self-inquiry as part of your practice, you could ask the question: "Who releases the sutras?". This could be extended to "Who is it who thinks they are thinking?".

This is an inquiry into the nature of the ahamkara (I-doer). When performed with inner silence present, we gradually see that this sense of self (small s) arises with the action, and passes away when the action ceases. So, the idea of someone releasing a sutra arises with the action of releasing the sutra. The idea of the person thinking a thought arises with the thought, and passes away with the thought. Normally in daily life, the speed with which these things happen is so fast, that it gives the illusion of a permanent separate self. But when the mind becomes calm and still and equanimous, this illusion begins to break down. Then we can see things clearly.

This is part of the process of the method of advaita.

You may find this lesson useful:

Lesson 350 - Practices for Moving Beyond the Witness Stage

This whole process is discussed in much more depth in the Self-inquiry book and in the Liberation book.


Christi
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interpaul

USA
281 Posts

Posted - May 31 2021 :  6:18:35 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Yogabuzz108, Thank you for sharing your perspective. Where else to mention duality than in a discussion on non duality.
Christi, Thank you for your cautionary note regarding self inquiry outside of my Samyama practice. Fortunately Yogani's message regarding thinking during my twice daily meditation practices are honored. This post was more of a reflection of an awareness of a change in my inner state.
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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1325 Posts

Posted - Jun 01 2021 :  11:22:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by interpaul


.. The reason I am posting this in the self inquiry section is it made me wonder who is that guy releasing the thoughts and who or what are these being released into? Does the process of surrender, i.e. releasing all control over this action somehow negate "me". If I am no longer in control of the process who/what is in control?



Dear Interpaul,

That is the emergence of the Observer, the famous Witness. "Someone" (an "I") is releasing sutras into "something". You can see enough to realise that this "I" is not your regular "little me" (hence your sense of it negating "me"). And that "something" into which you are releasing sutras appears to be the new "I". A reversal of your sense of "I" from the one doing the releasing into "the something" into which sutras are being released.

Have I captured your observations correctly?


Sey



Edited by - SeySorciere on Jun 01 2021 11:24:23 AM
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interpaul

USA
281 Posts

Posted - Jun 03 2021 :  03:38:30 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Sey, Yes, I think you've done a good job explaining my experience. Deconstructing the self is a bit of a daunting project.
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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1325 Posts

Posted - Jun 03 2021 :  12:53:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
You are doing good my friend. Enjoy the journey.


Sey
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