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 disappointment in everyone
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 19 2021 :  12:49:06 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Message
After my meditation session this morning I realized an undercurrent of disappointment I have in in almost everyone I have ever known (including myself). I believe this is a result of perfectionism and being raised by deeply narcicistic parents. It's not on a level of daily judging but more of an awareness at a deeper level of how I see the flaws in everyone. Not a pleasant realization to come to. I believe this is part of my entry into the self inquiry phase of my practice. In my day to day life I try to come from a place of gratitude and tolerance of people's shortcomings, yet, that deeper awareness of this world view is unsettling. Seeing this in myself feels a bit like embracing my shaddow. If you were to ask my family and friends they would probably tell you I am one of the more accepting and tolerant people they know. Honoring these glimpses of my shaddow that emerge out of inner silence is difficult. Have you come to face aspects of yourself that you don't like and how have you honored and integrated what bubbles up to the surface?

sunyata

USA
1473 Posts

Posted - Apr 19 2021 :  5:30:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
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Blanche

USA
738 Posts

Posted - Apr 19 2021 :  8:58:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit Blanche's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Interpaul,

Following meditation we do have a clearer view of reality. Yes, some of the things that come up may be difficult to accept, but that is the only way forward. I do not know anyone working to know themselves who found everything easy and simple. We are complicated beings, multilayered beings, multidimensional beings. The difficult parts are great lessons with the most potential to evolve, to learn more, and to get closer to what we are. They are the anodyne Emily Dickinson talks about:


THE HEART asks pleasure first,
And then, excuse from pain;
And then, those little anodynes
That deaden suffering;


Another way to look at this is that these things are things not fully purified. Often we do not even know the baggage we carry. When we see it, we start to have a choice about it. If our caregivers were very critical (mine were too when they were noticing me), we internalize their attitude and become excessively critical of ourselves and everything. And then we overcompensate by becoming extremely tolerant... It is like a script, like a program we run. And there is a choice to drop it if we want. When we see it, it starts to lose its grip on us.

Our attitude reflects on everyone else. We are woven together. When we feel disappointed in others, we tell them implicitly that they are not doing their best, that they should feel disappointed, too. Thus, we communicate that they are less than us, and we are more than them. I am not saying that this happens only to you. We all are doing this.

When we look up to someone, we communicate that they are better than us, and we are less than them. And we do see and treat others as equals. We all see every day how others come to play these patterns of relationships with us. But what is the truth?

As you know, eventually we get to see that what we are is everything, everybody; nobody is less or more. Others are us on a different timeline. And everything is relative. This is a big release from all these constrains and problems, and it comes with a lot of bliss, joy, love. In the way to this, we get to see and come to terms with all the things that are difficult for us. If we have a regular meditation practice, that is the cornerstone that allows us to deal with all the problems.

You may benefit from keeping a gratitude journal, or simply saying Thank-You and expressing gratitude for the things that you appreciate in your life, big and small. Do it when you wake up, before you get up from bed, and do it at bedtime. And do it randomly during the day. The heart opens, and sweetness pours out to heal all the run-down places in us to allow for a complete neurobiological update.
Good things are happening, and more is to come.

The guru is in you.
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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1375 Posts

Posted - Apr 20 2021 :  02:08:17 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
I recognize myself in this discussion. Disappointment or lack of trust? I guess it comes to the same thing. Accepting others as they are, is a very hard thing to do. It is easy to think you do but scratch the surface and you don't.


Sey
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zamolxes

Romania
90 Posts

Posted - Apr 20 2021 :  06:23:36 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hey Interpaul, I have had such moments too.

It happened that I began feeling uncomfortable around certain people, only to realize that the cause was some displeasure of mine. I the saw that I don't quite like the majority of people I have interacted with in the past, and for one part it came with a rush of repressed thoughts and judgments that began to came out, and on the other hand a certain release from some chains. It happens that we may start to see our hidden persona as we identify less with it, and slowly we begin to be able to work with our inquiry more freely.

Some inspiration I got was for example Ram Dass saying, that we could look at people the same way we look at trees. Because when we see nature, we don't judge it, we appreciate it just the way it is, so we could look at people the same way, just a ramification of the Universe, a game It plays with itself.

The I began to notice that I have a choice, to act as an effect on the karma I have with others, responding to people with the image they have of me, or transcend the karma, and be kind and anew in my relationships, take a step further from the commodity of my interactions. It gets harder with my family with which I have a lot of entanglements, and whom primarily participated in the image I have of life. But it too shall resolve itself in inner silence.
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 20 2021 :  11:30:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks everyone for your feedback and insights, very helpful. When I am brutally honest with myself I realize it is hard for me to trust. At a very basic level I haven't been able to trust in God. That life force that permeates everything is something I can relate to but have had many decades struggling with the idea of an interactive God, and ultimately have grown disillusioned and disappointed with humans largely due to what I see as our selfish nature. The amount of racism and sexism that permeates our society is constantly in the news. In the book Sapiens, A brief history of humankind, Harari describes our ancestors as being successful because of our selfish/aggressive nature which he suggests was instrumental in causing the extinction of the other humanoid species that coexisted with us at that time. I have heard people point out some selfish and unsettling behaviors/actions of some of the most loving individuals to walk this earth such as Martin Luther King Jr., Mother Teresa and Gandhi. Given all this it isn't surprising I might find myself judging others and myself. Shinning a light on repressed anger/fear/disappointment does seem to be what inner silence is challenging me to do.

quote:
Some inspiration I got was for example Ram Dass saying, that we could look at people the same way we look at trees. Because when we see nature, we don't judge it, we appreciate it just the way it is, so we could look at people the same way, just a ramification of the Universe, a game It plays with itself.

Zamolxes, I love this.

quote:
As you know, eventually we get to see that what we are is everything, everybody; nobody is less or more.

Blanche, "As you know" is flattering, but I will push back and say I don't know. I have read in many of the spiritual traditions of a view that we are all one. I get the idea of our universal heritage and how our actions are tied intimately with each other but I still haven't been able to accept the idea that we are fundamentally one. I still see people as independent expressions of the divine spark but autonomous but completely independent from me. If you and Zamolxes and Sey were all one we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Ultimately I sense "inner silence" does seem to be a back door to the divine. Shutting off this evolutionary wonder, the prefrontal cortex, and allowing the silent mind to just be has granted me a few insights in recent past that I imagine may be coming from this place of oneness. It does feel like a bit of a tease as I am offered challenging and different perspectives without clear answers. While I wait for my relational self inquiry muscle to strengthen at least I have this forum to share, for which I am grateful, AND my twice daily practices, thank you Yogani.
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maheswari

Lebanon
2515 Posts

Posted - Apr 20 2021 :  12:24:24 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hello Interpaul
The disappointment was already present before starting yoga practices.Usually when we understand that we can not invest our happiness in anyone or anything then we start searching for something solid not based on the whims of people around us nor the constantly changing life circumstances
Accepting people as they are does not mean that we dont speak up for what does not work for us, change what needs and can to be changed and sometimes exiting relationships (personal or professional etc....) that do not serve us anymore.

Edited by - maheswari on Apr 20 2021 12:30:01 PM
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kumar ul islam

United Kingdom
786 Posts

Posted - Apr 20 2021 :  12:30:37 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
give me something that is not flux
a form and thought that does not change
a silence maybe a roaring sound
are they not the impermanent patterns
that make the flow of flaw and result
show me reality i will give you billion suns
a trillion worlds an infinite number
so you can pick evaluate and judge in awe
now attach these to gods and deities alike
and bow in supplication to choregraphed reaction
conditioned by action inaction of body and mind
divinity infinity depending on your view
truth in everything truth in nothing
all passes even the hate the love the mundane
watch it pass at the dharma gate of joyful ease .


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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1375 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  12:44:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Brilliant Kumar...


Sey
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  01:26:39 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Maheswari, True. Nothing new, just a reframing and a deeper awareness. I just recently rewatched The Wizard of Oz with my son and the disillusionment Dorothy has when she realizes the wizard is just a man behind a curtain captures the feeling. That moment you realize your parents are flawed humans, the tooth fairy isn't real and God doesn't interact on your behalf is a tough thing to accept. AYP seems to point towards something bigger but it is requires a commitment of twice daily practices for years before the truths are revealed.

Kumar, Thank you for sharing your poetic perspective on impermanence and truth
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maheswari

Lebanon
2515 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  02:12:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi interpaul
There are no grandiose truths so don't wait for them , dont go into time
Your life is the truth
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sunyata

USA
1473 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  11:46:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Interpaul,

Your posts are beautiful as always. If all the wisdom traditions and saints are pointing to "Everything is That". Then the polarity/duality that you are experiencing within you and around you is "That" as well. And you embody and share it gracefully. Perhaps this type of sharing is needed in this contemporary spirituality and not just clinging to light and having a lopsided view.

Thank you for sharing.

Sunyata

Edited by - sunyata on Apr 21 2021 11:46:21 AM
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Christi

United Kingdom
3956 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  12:31:00 PM  Show Profile  Visit Christi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by interpaul

After my meditation session this morning I realized an undercurrent of disappointment I have in in almost everyone I have ever known (including myself). I believe this is a result of perfectionism and being raised by deeply narcicistic parents. It's not on a level of daily judging but more of an awareness at a deeper level of how I see the flaws in everyone. Not a pleasant realization to come to. I believe this is part of my entry into the self inquiry phase of my practice. In my day to day life I try to come from a place of gratitude and tolerance of people's shortcomings, yet, that deeper awareness of this world view is unsettling. Seeing this in myself feels a bit like embracing my shaddow. If you were to ask my family and friends they would probably tell you I am one of the more accepting and tolerant people they know. Honoring these glimpses of my shaddow that emerge out of inner silence is difficult. Have you come to face aspects of yourself that you don't like and how have you honored and integrated what bubbles up to the surface?



Hi Interpaul,

I have made use of a practice over the last 25 years which is called "cultivating loving kindness". It is a practice that can be used if we are experiencing blockages or are experiencing negative feelings towards others.

It is a self-inquiry practice and so requires that a certain degree of abiding inner silence is present in the mind. This gives us the ability to witness what is arising without becoming caught up with it. For people who are ready, it is a powerful practice.

I have described the practice here.


Christi
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 21 2021 :  7:24:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
There are no grandiose truths so don't wait for them

Maheswari, I always appreciate your sharing your perspective but your words did affect me. I can accept the flaws in individuals all around me as I do everyday, showing up with love anyway. I have not let go of the hope of some type of God or deeper meaning to my life. Yogani's teachings resonate with me and I sense a hopeful message suggesting something deeper comes from inner silence. I have, maybe naively, held on to the belief this talk of "relational self inquiry" is a subtle way of speaking to God, in the same way releasing sutras into silence is supposed to be associated with siddhis. Both could be considered magical or naive thinking.
Niesche's declaring "God is dead" seems to have harkened in an "enlightened" period. I see a lot of despair that comes from a life without
"grandiose truths".

Sunyata, Your kind words touched me, thank you.

Christi, Thank you for the link to this self inquiry version of the Buddhist Metta prayer. I don't have abiding inner silence yet but will consider taking up this practice as the silence grows.
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Christi

United Kingdom
3956 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  03:59:30 AM  Show Profile  Visit Christi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Interpaul,

quote:
Christi, Thank you for the link to this self inquiry version of the Buddhist Metta prayer. I don't have abiding inner silence yet but will consider taking up this practice as the silence grows.


Inner silence comes in time and then we can make use of these practices. Before inner silence arises with the witness, all inquiry into the self will tend to be non-relational by definition. This can be unhelpful and even dangerous. It tends to just be thoughts about thoughts and ideas about ideas. Is there a God, or no God? Are there grandiose truths or not? Should we embrace the shadow? It tends to be all speculation and building castles in the air, which usually leads away from inner silence rather than towards it.

With inner silence we develop the ability to discriminate between what is real and what is not real. What is not real simply falls away within the silence. This is the power of samadhi.

Remember that inner silence does not necessarily mean the absence of thoughts. It means the ability to observe things arising and passing away within the mind, without becoming attached to, or identified with them. Thoughts may or may not be present and that is not the important part.

You may find this page useful on relational self-inquiry:

Self-inquiry, the witness and non-duality.

quote:
AYP seems to point towards something bigger but it is requires a commitment of twice daily practices for years before the truths are revealed.


How long things take depends on the person and the degree to which they are ready. In my own case I was first taught meditation during 7 days on retreat in a monastery in Northern Thailand and at the end of 7 days I entered samadhi. I remained in samadhi for three days, unaware of the physical world, or of thoughts, and only aware of the true nature of the Self as bliss and light.

With AYP, the only requirement is that people practice for as long as is needed, in order to remove whatever obstructions they have, so that what is true is revealed to them. It could be 7 lifetimes, or 7 years, or 7 months, or 7 weeks, or 7 hours. It all depends on where each person is, in terms of their own journey.


Christi
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maheswari

Lebanon
2515 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  09:54:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
[With AYP, the only requirement is that people practice for as long as is needed, in order to remove whatever obstructions they have, so that what is true is revealed to them. It could be 7 lifetimes, or 7 years, or 7 months, or 7 weeks, or 7 hours. It all depends on where each person is, in terms of their own journey.
]
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maheswari

Lebanon
2515 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  09:58:31 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Is there a God, or no God? Are there grandiose truths or not? Should we embrace the shadow? It tends to be all speculation and building castles in the air, which usually leads away from inner silence rather than towards it.


Very well explained by Christ
At Interpaul: this is what I meant when I said don't wait for grandiose truths and to simply get on with your life and practices because these are are the truth at hand now.I was not suggesting despair.You have a tendency to over analyse , and linking things together, from nietezche to the shadow to siddhis to the past with your parents....relaxthis looping is not helpful. Just try to stick with practices without going much into ideas...keep it simple

Edited by - maheswari on Apr 22 2021 10:11:54 AM
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lightandlove

Germany
68 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  12:29:11 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Can you truly love yourself?
You are a sea full of love. It sprinkles out of every pore of your being.
Unless you cannot truly love yourself, how could you truly see love outside of you?
Interpaul, you are wonderful as you are and you can embrace every part of your self no matter how bright it seems to you.
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  1:02:50 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Christi and Maheswari, Thank you for your additional comments. I do experience some inner silence, just not abiding yet. It is from that place, I believe, my "insights" emerge. They are a bit of a tease in that I am being advised to not analyse or try to make sense of them with the non relational iquiry mode (the only mode I have access to at present). I understand the emergence of the witness comes to each of us on a different time frame based on what "obstructions" we bring to the table. The expectation an educated person can patiently await the arrival of abiding inner silence before trying to make sense of important spiritual matters feels unrealistic. I fully embrace Yogani's teaching of digging in the same place rather than the impatient sampling of many places. The challenge is one looses ones agency by completely surrendering to the practices without any inquiry.

The real risk from my perspective in just sticking with the practices patiently awaiting the arrival of the witness is it runs the risk of false allegiance. Think of all the flat earthers who, no matter what science shows, they stick with their beliefs. Or for that matter, all the religious communities who say "our way is the only way, just have faith". Science has succeeded and helped us forge our modern society (albeit it with a lack of spiritual sensibilities) with all its benefits based on a non relational self inquiry process. I trust in Yogani's teachings as I have experienced some of the milestones along the way. The "grandiose truths" I desparately seek to understand seem very relevant to me as I approach the last third of my life. I have come to realize my "ishta, my chosen ideal" is the very seeking of Truth with a capital T.
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Christi

United Kingdom
3956 Posts

Posted - Apr 22 2021 :  3:05:50 PM  Show Profile  Visit Christi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Interpaul,

The rational mind is a very useful tool for many things. But when it comes to knowing Truth with a capital T, then the rational mind actually becomes an obstacle. It is the rational mind that keeps us from knowing the Truth, or rather, it is our relationship with the mind, including the reasoning aspect of the mind (buddhi), that keeps us from knowing the truth.

The rational mind is useful on the spiritual path, to bring us up to the point where we realize that we have to transcend it. We need to realize that we have a problem, which is the problem of suffering, and we need to realize that there is a way out of suffering. But when we come to the gate, which is the gate of inner silence, then we need to learn how to let go. Truth with a capital T, is beyond duality, whereas the mind exists within duality. Within the mind everything is good and bad, right and wrong, light and dark, beautiful or ugly, desired or not desired, self or other, pleasure or pain. Everything is separate and moving between birth and death. It is a dream world, like the shadows on the wall of Socrates' cave, and identification with it leads only to suffering.

So, to come upon Truth with a capital T, we need to learn how to move beyond identification with the mind. This does not involve embracing the shadow. In truth there is no shadow, that is only a perception of the mind. Nietzsche never lived. God never died. These are all just the shadows on the wall of the cave. When it comes to the realization of truth, they are all nothing. No more real than a dream. If someone woke up after being asleep and dreaming, and they still believed that what happened in their dream was real, we would think they were mad. But what actually happens when people wake up from a dream is that they realize that they were just dreaming, no matter how real it seemed whilst they were asleep. They know that they were asleep and dreaming and that the dream happened, but they no longer identify with the dreamer.

The spiritual path is about learning how to awaken to Truth, and no longer identify with the dreamer of the dream, or with the world of the dream. As Jesus said "be in the world, but not of the world".

So when we are on the spiritual path, at a certain stage, we need to begin to relate to the mind in a different way. That stage comes, when we begin to have glimpses of inner silence. This is the rise of the witness. In the beginning it may not be strong, or stable, or present all of the time, but it is the doorway to our own awakening. If insights emerge, which they will, we can release them into that silence. If epiphanies arise, we can release them into silence. If we have the greatest idea on Earth, which we will do, because that is how the mind works, we can release it into silence, to whatever degree of inner silence we have. And other things will arise too, such as fear and existential dread. If we don't learn how to let go of the simple things, then we will become completely unstuck when difficult things arise.

And it is true that all religions say "our way is the only way, just have faith". And they are right. Not because all paths lead up to the top of the mountain. If they did, then one way would be as good as any other. They are all right, because in truth, there is no mountain and no one to climb it. Ideas about "our way" or "your way", or "our God" or "your God", are just part of the shadows on the walls of the cave. They have no existence at all in reality.

But faith is necessary. For reasoning we need intelligence, but to transcend the mind we need other qualities, because transcendence is not something that can be calculated or figured-out. Useful qualities at this stage are ones such as intuition, bhakti, determination, faith (shraddha), trust, patience, humility and the ability to surrender (yajna). These are all qualities that grow as we practice, so the practice itself provides the qualities needed at each stage.

As to your question, should someone expect an educated person to patiently await the arrival of abiding inner silence before trying to make sense of important spiritual matters? In my experience, there isn't another option. There is no such thing as making sense of important spiritual matters, when we are still identified with the mind. That would be like the dreamer trying to make sense of the dream. It would not lead to awakening from the dream. For awakening to happen, there has to be a completely different process taking place.


Christi
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 23 2021 :  12:22:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Christi, I can't help but feel like Neo speaking with Morpheus with this dialogue (not to imply I am the one, although ironically we are all the one I suspect once we release from duality). I really appreciate you taking the time to try and paint a vision of the world beyond this dream like state we call reality. I like the allegory of the cave and it certainly helps to reframe this. Sitting in my cave looking at the shadows on the wall and interpreting them with my rational mind it is hard to truly believe there is a world beyond this dream. You are a kind person to make yourself available in this way as a guide. Thank you for pointing out the qualities needed at this stage in the journey.

Lightandlove, Sorry I missed your earlier response. Finding self love and self acceptance certainly is a critical part of healing wounds from my past. I had expected I'd have life more figured out by now. I realize this is not a competition and we all have to progress at our own rate. Thank you for your loving words of support.
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zamolxes

Romania
90 Posts

Posted - Apr 23 2021 :  05:53:33 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Krishnamurti had once a speech about mediocrity, not in the undermining sense of the word, but mediocrity in the sense of not grasping Truth.

The point he makes, is that until we are whole, we are mediocre. In other words, being fragmented is the trap. So when we excel in certain fields, but the rest of our daily life is narrow, we are mediocre. If we find out we are mediocre, trying to be then whole sets again a mediocrity in the game. The mind, they say, is an illusion. So we hear of unity, and the mind tries to make that a goal, and in doing so it becomes something separate. But in between the realization and the response, there is Truth.

The duality comes when we are aware that we are aware, when we know that we live, instead of just living. This is the source of suffering, having a need, or an anxiety out of life. It may have come, as K says, because of the unwritten system of reward and punishment. If we do something right, we are rewarded, and if we don't follow on it we are punished. So we start to reward ourselves with enlightenment when we start doing practices, and when we think we don't get it we punish ourselves with excuses.

Although, these seeings may come with inner silence, and with non-relational inquiry, it is never early to open your eyes, to be serious about what's going on inside.

He says we are halfway up the hill, and when we see this (for instance that we live in duality) we may try to go up the hill, but then that action sets again the duality. The hill is the inward reality, and all reactions, all that the mind understands, happens outwardly.

Then the point is, to listen. Not trying to listen, to find out, but listen. Listening even to this listening echoing in us. And while in AYP, we just practice and the openings happen with time, there are occasions in which we face the separation, and we create the noise trying to understand. We bring excuses such as the shadow, or the past, or because of certain conditionings, or that we need more inner silence, or that there's a mystery out there and we are not ready. We stop listening, that is, we stop abiding in silence. As to what can be done, I don't know, there's nothing really to be done, just to be un-done. The same principle of deep meditation takes place, in which we come back to silence, to listening, whenever we find ourselves making noise, trying to understand, even when are in the habit of inquirying, we gently go back to being during the course of daily activity. That has been working for me, especially after becoming over-sensitive to practices, or overly anxious about stuff.

Outside of these insecurities, there is nothing going wrong. No story unfolding, not a difference between you and Christi for example. There's being, and believing that we are not yet being.
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Christi

United Kingdom
3956 Posts

Posted - Apr 23 2021 :  05:55:30 AM  Show Profile  Visit Christi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Interpaul,

quote:
Christi, I can't help but feel like Neo speaking with Morpheus with this dialogue (not to imply I am the one, although ironically we are all the one I suspect once we release from duality). I really appreciate you taking the time to try and paint a vision of the world beyond this dream like state we call reality. I like the allegory of the cave and it certainly helps to reframe this. Sitting in my cave looking at the shadows on the wall and interpreting them with my rational mind it is hard to truly believe there is a world beyond this dream. You are a kind person to make yourself available in this way as a guide. Thank you for pointing out the qualities needed at this stage in the journey.




The story of the Matrix was actually based on yoga and on the process of awakening. If you watch the film The Matrix Revolutions and watch the credits right at the end of the film, the soundtrack played is sung in Sanskrit. The song is called Navras and the lyrics are taken from the Upanishads (the Vedas).

These are some of the Sanskrit lyrics with translation:

Asato ma sadgamaya
Tamaso ma jyotirgamaya
Mrityor ma amritamgamaya

"Lead me from the unreal to the real
Lead me from the darkness to the light
Lead me from death to immortality"

Om Shanti, shanti, shanti

"Om peace, peace, peace"

Jnani manasa saha
Buddhis ca na vicestate
Tam ahuh paramam gatim

"When knowledge, the mind and reason are still
Then begins the path supreme."


This is the song on Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A67...nel=appiglio


Christi
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 23 2021 :  5:46:35 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Zamolxes, I really appreciate your sharing this perspective, it speaks to the Truth I am searching for and to the suffering I unintentionally cause myself. Letting go of our stories and just living in the present moment sounds wonderful, and is wonderful, but hard to do. I recall years ago finally understanding this deep truth while listening to Eckhart Tolle speak of enlightenment being here now if we can just let go of the need to talk to ourselves in our head and just remain silent and present. As I attempted to do this I realized how unhappy my ego was to abandon that inner voice which has been yammering on for my entire life. Ego death, as I understand it now would require refocusing attention away from that thinking mind to the inner silence. Fortunately having achieved moments of inner silence during meditation, and realizing how natural healthy and peaceful that state is, it is becoming easier for me to let go more of the need to be in control. When I previously tried to achieve that state I had deep fear around not being able to solve some of the bigger personal struggles in my life as I was concerned it would make me aloof and resigned to no change. It is a bit of a leep of faith to imagine a future where one functions from a place of inner silence and to trust that it will lead in the right direction, rather than a spiritual bypass of sorts.

Christi, The Matrix is one of my all time favorite movies. There are so many powerful messages in it that resonated from the moment I saw it. So interesting how much it ties in to my current journey in the way you point out.
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k.cherry

USA
77 Posts

Posted - Apr 23 2021 :  7:58:35 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Navras by Juno Reactor! Listened to that song many, many times back in the day and had no idea what it was saying. For some reason I never thought I'd see discussions of electronic music in the AYP forums.

Interpaul, I can relate to this post, and I always appreciate reading about your candid personal inquiries. If my path has been about anything the last couple years, it's been about unpacking difficult, repressed emotions and the "shadowy" traits of my psyche's potential. I basically went through a shift where I rejected everybody, including many of my friends and family. It was/is motivated by a sense of fear, like a sense of not wanting to be eaten (prey response). However, there's definitely some harsh judgement present in some form, both of myself and others.

When you mentioned that it's a tough thing to accept that God might not act on your behalf, that really hit home for me. I feel sometimes that my path is one where I've been given an ability to help others in exactly the same ways that I wish I could receive help. "OK, let me get this straight, God. You want me to give away freely to others that which I most want to receive? Obviously you're correct you're going to win, so please give this little tiny ego the sight to see!"

I get a strong impression that you're a very understanding and patient person who is keenly aware of the needs of others and the sanctity of their space. I imagine it might be difficult for you to find somebody that can really keep up with you there in daily life. Helpful or not, the arising of judgement would seem quite natural in that case.

-KC
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interpaul

USA
345 Posts

Posted - Apr 24 2021 :  12:19:58 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
I feel sometimes that my path is one where I've been given an ability to help others in exactly the same ways that I wish I could receive help.

K. cherry, Do unto others. You are correct. I do a lot of giving and do at times get frustrated when I don't feel I'm appreciated. I think my recent rant is really about my frustrations in my marriage, not feeling appreciated. Someone recently shared with me this quote from the Bhagavad Gita "You have the freedom over action alone never over its fruits" Thank you for your kind words.
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