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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 04 2016 : 10:18:45 PM
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Hi :)
I have not been here for years now.. some of you know me but probably many here don't.. Anyway :)
I just wanted to come back here now because I wrote something about my understanding of karma, which might be interesting to some. (wrote it on Facebook so just going to copy and paste :) )
Enjoy!
Dear friends..
I would like to talk a little about my understanding of the concept of Karma.
Karma is a concept from the Hindu and Buddhist tradition, but it also comes in many forms and ideas in other traditions. Some I do not know but some that I know of are for example Judaism and Christianity where the bible says "Love your neighbor as yourself". Karma means that whatever you do to another (in Buddhism it is more specifically "with intention") will come back to you in this life or a future life in a certain form.
I personally believe in karma. I see in in my own life and working in the world around me. Karma is most of all energy. we all put out energy in varying forms, intensities and accompanied by different intentions (which we are aware of or unaware of). Now the different forms of energy/karma/anything you will get in the future is mostly dependent upon the one that you put out, and act/acted upon in the past and (this is VERY important) the one you put out NOW. Because, this is extremely important, even if we did negative things in the past, in this life or a past one, we can change our direction with a strong intention (such as "I intend to do good, the most good I can in every moment") in order to move to a better life in this one ("IN THIS ONE" is also very important, not even talking about the next ones if there will be ones).
All we have to do to change our lives for the better is intend. And watch the magic happen. It may take a while (yup) if we have much to get over. But with intention and resolve we move forward steadily and responsibly. Karma can be got over, TONS of it in fact, when we really want to move to a better place. And we can't be half-decided or resolved and we truly want to move forward, because this is a "half-intention" and we have to know that we will always get our karma which affects ourselves and others, helping us move forward and get more motivated in our resolve or discouraged. And in the end, what we do to others we do to ourselves. that's the truth of it. And I'm not talking about "see everything as one" because many of us are still not in that place where we are advanced enough spiritually to be able to, I mean just simply understanding that we either help or hinder/make it hard on ourselves by our own actions.. :)
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)
That's my understanding of karma. hope you enjoy..  :)
Yonatan
 
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Edited by - Yonatan on Aug 04 2016 10:20:29 PM |
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Blanche
USA
859 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2016 : 12:22:09 AM
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Yonatan,
Thanks for sharing. Your understanding resonates with the yoga tradition. Vasishta, one of the seven Rishis, says that what we call karma is the result of our past actions - the result of our self-efforts from the past. Complaining about our karma is complaining about our actions. |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2016 : 04:21:06 AM
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Quote Yonathan
quote:
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)
Hi Yonathan,
Thank you for sharing your insights about karma, it resonates.
Ignorance is one of the reasons why we don't know how to handle with the best intent for ourselves. It's the tragedy of mankind, we just don't know, looking for love in all sorts of (sometimes not to understand by others) way's. Isn't the choice we make in the moment always the best we can ?
I asked myself that question and I believe we do. We make choices to our best intent, we just don't know better. The world around us is our mirror, where we are born, our parents, friends, education, all has his influence. We grow up as a reflection of our surroundings.
And then one day, sometimes it seems out of nothing we become AWARE, we see with new eyes.
Then the journey goes further with AWARENESS like you shared above, we start to listen, like Arjuna start to listen to Krishna.
This is my perspective at this moment.
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Edited by - Charliedog on Aug 05 2016 05:30:20 AM |
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amuhai
USA
18 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2016 : 1:39:09 PM
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Nice. Yes, karma is energy.
It is also stored in the Spine---as energy matrix.
Any form of Spinal Breathing or kriya breathing works to dissipate this energy matrix in the spine or sushumna.
So, a much faster way to dissolve Karma is by steady regular Spinal Breathing, followed by meditation.
Action is much, much faster than intention in acting on karmic energy, since by action, a direct play on the energy field is taking place.
But spinal breathing, especially if followed by meditation, is faster than intention or action.
Spinal breathing works directly on the seeds of karma stored in the spine.
Awareness of emotions , or body scanning--- as in vipassana---, follows the conversion of inner energy matrix as it dissipates externally as emotions, thoughts, or physical sensations. It is a passive way of dissipating karma.
Spinal Breathing is a pro-active, conscious and controlled way, and faster way to dissolve karma than awareness of emotions or intention or action. The first way attacks the store of karma, the others observe the expression of karma.
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2016 : 4:02:30 PM
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Thank you
Blanche yes
Charliedog, I very much resonate with your perspective also.. and I think so that we can always just think and act from where our consciousness is at that moment, our awareness. The more we allow the moment and let go into the flow the higher our consciousness becomes, the higher our actions and intentions and so it goes..
very good perspective
Amuhai yes I agree with you and thank you for making it more specific about practices. I think that a practice such as spinal breathing and meditation is a fast way to move more into love - love of self and others, dissolving karma into love/high vibrations/light. So yes all is true..
The actions and intentions that result from a pratice like this will be higher because of it and so the upward spiral moves..
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Edited by - Yonatan on Aug 05 2016 4:12:08 PM |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Aug 05 2016 : 4:16:59 PM
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I think it all just has to do with bhakti  |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2016 : 03:25:28 AM
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| The complete eight folded path of Patanjali is required to get to know ourselves, including yama & niyama. We start somewhere on the path and the other limbs will be affected and open up. All in our own time with the help of bhakti |
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sunyata
USA
1505 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2016 : 09:15:04 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
Quote Yonathan
quote:
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)
Hi Yonathan,
Thank you for sharing your insights about karma, it resonates.
Ignorance is one of the reasons why we don't know how to handle with the best intent for ourselves. It's the tragedy of mankind, we just don't know, looking for love in all sorts of (sometimes not to understand by others) way's. Isn't the choice we make in the moment always the best we can ?
I asked myself that question and I believe we do. We make choices to our best intent, we just don't know better. The world around us is our mirror, where we are born, our parents, friends, education, all has his influence. We grow up as a reflection of our surroundings.
And then one day, sometimes it seems out of nothing we become AWARE, we see with new eyes.
Then the journey goes further with AWARENESS like you shared above, we start to listen, like Arjuna start to listen to Krishna.
This is my perspective at this moment.
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sunyata
USA
1505 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2016 : 09:16:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
The complete eight folded path of Patanjali is required to get to know ourselves, including yama & niyama. We start somewhere on the path and the other limbs will be affected and open up. All in our own time with the help of bhakti
Yes. They start opening like beautiful petals of lotus. |
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sunyata
USA
1505 Posts |
Posted - Aug 06 2016 : 5:28:37 PM
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Hi Yonatan,
It's nice to hear from you. I used to read your posts from when I had not signed up as a member in the forums. Your posts always have nuggets of wisdom.
quote:
Originally posted by Yonatan
Hi :)
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)
Yes!!! This has been one of the many big realization. Compassion and empathy for others have come naturally to me. Looking back, I had not been this way to myself. I think a lot of people tend to be hard on oneself but I took it a step further.
Self Love, Self compassion are two of the many gifts that I have received on the spiritual path. Like you said as we change on the inside, the outside changes. Then, it becomes one big divine play, divine intoxication & divine romance.
I recently met a wise meditation teacher that I have written about. He says " Love our neighbor as ourself. But not instead of ourself. Or more than ourself." This was profound for me. |
Edited by - sunyata on Aug 06 2016 5:58:44 PM |
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Blanche
USA
859 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2016 : 08:31:48 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Yonatan
...Karma is most of all energy. we all put out energy in varying forms, intensities and accompanied by different intentions (which we are aware of or unaware of). Now the different forms of energy/karma/anything you will get in the future is mostly dependent upon the one that you put out, and act/acted upon in the past and (this is VERY important) the one you put out NOW.
...
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)...
Yonatan's post made me think about the relationship between karma and dharma. Karma, as energy, is felt as resistance. Karma helps us heal and find balance. It requires us to complete past experiences and purify. Thus, the knots of karma unravel and there is a chance for the flow of life to move freely.
Dharma, as purpose, is felt as love and its corollaries - happiness, joy, bliss. Dharma supports the purpose of our journey. Dharma comes with the opening of the heart to the divine flow, and brings with it deep happiness and peace. Thus, the advice: "Follow your bliss."
A karmic situation is a drama - it grows out of proportions, or it solves and ends. A dharmic situation takes life in a new direction. The inner work clears karma, so the dharma can flow and take us all the way home. |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2016 : 08:39:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Blanche
Dharma, as purpose, is felt as love and its corollaries - happiness, joy, bliss. Dharma supports the purpose of our journey. Dharma comes with the opening of the heart to the divine flow, and brings with it deep happiness and peace. Thus, the advice: "Follow your bliss."
A karmic situation is a drama - it grows out of proportions, or it solves and ends. A dharmic situation takes life in a new direction. The inner work clears karma, so the dharma can flow and take us all the way home.
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2016 : 10:14:16 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Yonatan
It all comes down to:.... Loving OURSELVES!! This whole movement of karma is not evil. it wants to nudge us forward and deeply understand that we have to LOVE ourselves FIRST OF ALL. then later things move to the outside more and more and more untill the whole universe is our LOVE pool. :)
Well said, Yonatan. The Golden Rule. I am you. You are me. We are one. |
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lalow33
USA
966 Posts |
Posted - Aug 07 2016 : 4:50:20 PM
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Yonatan,
So happy to see you here! |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Aug 09 2016 : 03:08:22 AM
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Yes I agree Charlie it's like focusing positively one one aspect in the body or mind helps the rest. It is also a global movement like if a few people or one person is waking up it affects everyone on the planet. Same with the yoga aspects and path. Everything opens up. Your waking up and loving is the loving and awakening of the whole.
Thank you sunyata I appreciate it.
And the teacher you talk about is wise :D
Blanche. Powerful perspective. Thanks. Yes the dharma helps dissolve the karma knots. Which makes me think about the practice of bastrika which I read here yogani's lesson but never tried because my purification is already quite strong. I think it's like.. using the practice to dissolve a specific "karma point" in the sushumna. That's also why service to others helps because seeing all as a body of your "big self" is like dissolving someone else's karma (a "karma point" in the body of humanity") is helpful to your self and brings more energy through you/the SELF. In effect helping all. Hope this is clear how I put it
Bodhi
Thanks lalow :D :D
Peace to all.
:D
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Blanche
USA
859 Posts |
Posted - Aug 12 2016 : 08:25:47 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Yonatan
Yes the dharma helps dissolve the karma knots. Which makes me think about the practice of bastrika which I read here yogani's lesson but never tried because my purification is already quite strong. I think it's like.. using the practice to dissolve a specific "karma point" in the sushumna. That's also why service to others helps because seeing all as a body of your "big self" is like dissolving someone else's karma (a "karma point" in the body of humanity") is helpful to your self and brings more energy through you/the SELF. In effect helping all. Hope this is clear how I put it
Hi Yonathan,
The karma is not easy to dissolve. Most of the karma comes with a blind spot. In the Iliad, there is a line saying something like "The gods take one's mind when they want his misfortune." Karma comes often with a lack of clarity in the perception and the understanding of the situation. Even in awakened people, karma arises and plays out. There are enough stories about spiritual teachers involved in very human dramas. One could watch karmic situations unfold without getting caught in them, but one cannot always dissolve them.
One way to see our own karma is to look at the relationships we have. There is a saying, "If you think you are enlightened, go spend a week with your parents." Other people are mirrors for what we are going through. How many times do we blame others when relationships become difficult? How often are we really willing to look at our contribution to the problem? Difficult relationships are knots of energy, and when we dissolve them for us, we dissolve them in a certain degree for everyone else involved - as you point out.
The best method to clear up karma is to meditate. Other things may help, but DM is the most powerful practice to clean up the layers of our being. As you know, DM is not a doing, but an undoing - and this is hard enough In DM, we let the skilful divine untangle the knots of our being.
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Edited by - Blanche on Aug 13 2016 07:06:35 AM |
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dv2014
USA
93 Posts |
Posted - Aug 12 2016 : 12:52:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Yonatan
There is a saying, "If you think you are enlightened, go spend a week with your parents." Other people are mirrors for what we are going through.
so true, |
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FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2016 : 03:19:09 AM
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| How can Pranayama/meditation dissolve one's Karma? Any theory on that? It looks like one cannot avoid reaping what has been sown. How can that possibly be nullified? |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2016 : 09:12:27 AM
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Hi FakeYogi,
We will develop a broader perspective by the practice of Yoga. Within this broader perspective we will get the chance to see our pitfalls. When our blind spots are more visible, by purification and opening (the development of inner silence), we will plant other seeds. We have the choice to change direction. By looking back we can see this after some time of serious practice. |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2016 : 09:28:07 AM
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Hi FakeYogi:
Charliedog puts it in a nutshell very well. The more we cultivate abiding inner silence the more karma becomes progressive and evolutionary in our life, instead of the punitive grind most people think it is. Daily practice can dramatically change our relationship with karma over time.
Here is a lesson that goes into some detail. It is called "Transcending Karma and Putting It to Good Use" - http://www.aypsite.org/344.html
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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Jim and His Karma
2110 Posts |
Posted - Aug 14 2016 : 2:39:55 PM
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You've heard the phrase "Let go, let God"?
Karma is what's let go of (or increased, if you're inclined the other way).
You may appear to build it, or to reduce it, but it's not real. It's nothing but resistance to reality. |
Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 14 2016 2:40:46 PM |
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FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Aug 18 2016 : 2:16:06 PM
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| Thanks Jim. So it is just a resistance to reality implies that no second person is required for karma to take effect right? i.e. for example if you indulge in something and enjoy the sensory or some such experience (self identify with it thus forming a latent impression) then the karma of this will at a future period make you not able to enjoy that sensory experience while longing for it. i.e. if you at one time womanize and enjoy it, another time in this life or later you will be impotent and suffer. |
Edited by - FakeYogi on Aug 18 2016 2:25:19 PM |
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FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Aug 20 2016 : 02:05:01 AM
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| Ain't it? Yonatan? |
Edited by - FakeYogi on Aug 21 2016 12:50:59 AM |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2016 : 5:52:04 PM
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Hi FakeYogi, I am sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.
I think that karma is most of all as Jim wisely said a resistance to reality or as some would put it, the "flow" of things. when you don't flow you are in resistance, and that flow is actually Love or as Yogani says Stillness in action (Love/God in action through our physical being). If I may I'd like to say my own understanding about this relating to your question. Your Soul wants to move in the direction of Pure love, and be love in movement. So if you womanize and you enjoy it (the sensory feelings) you may be able to do it for some time as long as your soul stays in about the same place or spiritual development. but inside, if you know that you are doing something wrong, if you hurt another being or yourself, then the soul is not "in the right place" and will at some point want to move on. some circumstance will happen (bad karma so to speak) that will make you want to not do this anymore, and as long as you continue indulging in the "old" programming/behaviour that keeps you down and not evolving, you will continue to receive that feedback from the universe that what you are doing is not good (the "bad karma"). because the effects of the causes come late in this dimension on earth, we have latent impressions of things we may have done lifetimes ago and also ways of thinking that we are not even aware of that "need" to change in order for us to progress spiritually, so when the soul feels like it is time to move to a higher place, those come out so we can heal/dissolve/love them to completion, meaning our karma is cleared. ultimately "our karma" is the whole universe, so even when our physical body is clear so to speak (it always evolves by the way as long as it's here, and our soul does also) we continue to evolve by being love in the best way we can thereby serving the universe. So we may not suffer anymore but we will always move on to better things whatever they may be.
regarding how latent impressions will manifest (if it's impotency for womanizing or something else) I really can't tell you. But in short the karma will come to show you some things about your self than need to be updated. And if you let go and let God it will move on faster and more smoothly. it's about letting go/being with what is/accepting/being love. meditation and practices help in that they dissolve the latent impressions thus "removing" the need for the karma to appear later in life.
I kind of blabbed a lot here, but I hope it helps :)
Yonatan |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Dec 09 2016 : 5:55:06 PM
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| And to answer about thinking only not involving another being physically, yes thinking is also creating, so yes thinking can create latent impessions, karma, but it is less in force than actually doing something physically after thinking the thoughts about it. |
Edited by - Yonatan on Dec 09 2016 5:56:18 PM |
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Yonatan
Israel
849 Posts |
Posted - Jan 04 2017 : 11:26:18 AM
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I am beginning to be grateful for karma. And it is opening me up.
I forgive karma and negativity. And therefore am forgiven.
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A short writing of my understanding of karma
