Shared Left Border

 

 

 

Help Yourself
And Others



Notices

What's New on
AYP Plus?

AYP Retreats
Worldwide Listing


AYP Teacher Training

Local Contacts
Meditation Groups,
Training & Retreats


Key L
essons

Start Lessons Here

Desire - Bhakti

Deep Meditation

Self-Pacing

Spinal Breathing
Pranayama

Chakras

Mulabandha

Sambhavi Mudra

Asanas - Postures

Siddhasana

Yoni Mudra
Kumbhaka

Uddiyana - Nauli

Navi Kriya

Kechari Mudra

Chin Pump
Jalandhara

Eight Limbs of Yoga

Samyama & Siddhi

Spinal Bastrika
Pranayama

Heart Breathing

Yoga Nidra
Cosmic Samyama

Mantra Enhancements

Solar Centering

Tantra

Brahmacharya

Vajroli Mudra

Whole Body Mudra

Yogic Diet

Fasting

Addictions

Hallucinogens

Shatkarmas

Amaroli

Nectar Cycle

Kundalini
Assistance

Sensitivity Issues

Spirits & Entities

Shaktipat

Self-Inquiry
Jnana - Advaita

End of Suffering

Karma Yoga

Dare to Dream

Evolution of Action

Prayer & Healing

Yoga for Children

Ayurveda

Summary of Practices

Time Management

Modifications to
Baseline System

Teaching

Retreats

Enlightenment
Milestones

Freedom


More Resources

AYP Plus

Public Forum

Plus Forum

AYP Survey

audioicon1.jpg (812 bytes)
AYP on Radio & TV

Yoga FAQ

Sanskrit Glossary

AYP Books & Audio

Downloads

AYP Books Flyer

Extended Booklist

International
Translations

Press Releases

Articles & Media

Promotional
Materials

Website Traffic

Links

AYP-Related Websites

Social Networks

Volunteer

Donate

AYP Public Forum
AYP Public Forum
AYP Home | Main Lessons | Tantra Lessons | AYP Plus | Retreats | AYP Books
Profile | Register | Active Topics | Members | Forum FAQ | Search
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 AYPsite.org Forum
 Satsang Cafe - General Discussions on AYP
 Dude, Where's my Practice?
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 2

tonightsthenight

846 Posts

Posted - Aug 11 2014 :  12:22:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Message

Hello fellow travelers.

Here's a story that might generate an interesting discussion. As always, feedback appreciated.

A couple months ago I encountered a series of physical maladies in close succession. The message? Slow down :)

I was completely incapable of performing my regular duties as a member of society for a few days, and unable to return to normal activities for about five weeks. During that time there were episodes where I forgot who I was, essentially in survival mode.

Practices were out of the question.

I gradually regained my 'self' and now I'm fine. Only, to this day, I can't seem to get back on track with my practices.

My meditations are inconsistent and seemingly ineffective. Pranayama is just okay. Asana practice isn't all that great either. Samayama? Not sure I could even call it that, although I'll give it a shot here and there.

The twist: I'm finding greater balance in my everyday life, and more quickly, then ever before. There is constant recognition of the patterns of life, a great web of interaction. I'm generally at peace throughout the day and I feel the divine flow moving through me.

That's not to say that everything is amazing, of course. And there is a level of stillness and flow that was once nearly constant in practices but inconsistent in daily life that I cannot quite seem to reach.

So all that's to say: with this lack of consistent, good practices, I've found more balance in daily life. Although less of the incredible stuff during practices. And there is simply much better alignment overall, something I've been aiming for since this trip began.

There are some things I 'miss', although that's not the right word because I don't really miss anything. Like the intense feelings of unity, the very palpable divine flow, the instant samadhi.

So I will favor more consistent practices as I travel on. But I have found it very interesting that this falloff in practices has coincided to more balance in daily life, even a greater integration of my temporal self with the things of this world. No longer separated from the temporal, living on the margins, but more active and engaged, doing gods work so to speak.

Your words, as always, are more valuable than diamonds.

Thanks :)

CarsonZi

Canada
3189 Posts

Posted - Aug 11 2014 :  12:51:22 PM  Show Profile  Visit CarsonZi's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
This sounds very similar to what happened to me TTN. I tried for months to get back into practices but they never came back for more than a week at a time before I had to stop again. That was in January 2012. The path didn't stop though, instead "the practices" changed into something non-formal and entirely constant. Not sure what will happen for you, but I wish you all the best. May your newfound stability remain indefinitely.

Love,
Carson
Go to Top of Page

Dogboy

USA
1794 Posts

Posted - Aug 11 2014 :  1:24:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Often in 'sickness' we are changed on the other side in some way, as if the temporal body needed the downtime to recalibrate. Maybe the spiritual progress isn't lost, but reborn into something new. Even if the physical side of meditation is 'quieter' (you pick the adjective!) stay with the practice and discover what unfolds! Your insight and every-day experience are an indication and a validation of the Guru In You!
Go to Top of Page

SeySorciere

Seychelles
1280 Posts

Posted - Aug 12 2014 :  12:36:37 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm sorry to hear you have not been well TNT. Next time - yell - so that we can send you lots of love if not chicken soup.




Sey
Go to Top of Page

BlueRaincoat

United Kingdom
1631 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  05:38:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
I'm joining Carson, Dogboy and SeySorciere in their good wishes to you.

Here's my guess about you fall-off in practices coinciding with more balance in daily life. The balance is likely to be the result of your yoga practice so far. The felling better is because the cleansing/purification stopped since you've taken the break.

If my guess is correct, then it might be worth trimming back your practice when you do resume it, so that you achieve more overal balance but also keep making progress.



Go to Top of Page

pkj

USA
155 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  12:52:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
TNT

I can say from experience sometimes it is difficult to figure out why you feel good or why you feel bad. I found myself let everything flow as it is and surrender to the changes that is happening.

Wishing you all the best.

PKJ
Go to Top of Page

tonightsthenight

846 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  2:11:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you all for your responses! I've found it interesting to reflect on this.

Lately I've been advising others that after a break from some activity, you often come back stronger. Perhaps I should listen to my own advice (I usually don't!).

Practice, right now, feels like butting my head against a brick wall. I think it's good to let it go a bit more. And also let go of the story that I practice everyday, rain or shine (as long as I'm not overloading -another story). The thing about stories is that they are true, for a time, but the moment will come when they are not true.

So rather than keeping one foot on land and one foot in water, I'll jump in and accept the new reality.

Still, I am not giving up on yoga! Yoga goes beyond sitting practices. I am fully engaged in karma yoga and bhakti yoga.

Perhaps sitting practices are not as important as we think. Perhaps they are not always appropriate. My experience is a drop in the sea.
Still, as Yogani would point out, there is no replacement for daily meditation for the cultivation of inner silence. Not sure how to handle that one. And I have noticed an increase in my carnal appetites during this time.

Thanks again for your thoughts. I know others have navigated these waters before. My respect and admiration goes out to every one of you.




Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  3:21:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
For a long time, I could only do a hand stand by kicking up from my right leg. This bugged me, so I completely focused on kicking up with my left leg for a while. Eventually, it clicked! Not the slightest problem! But know what? I could no longer kick up from my right leg. In fact, it's proving way way harder to relearn right leg now than it previously was to learn left.

Ideally, I'd have gently worked on both legs from the start. Instead, I flipped from extreme to extreme to extreme, with each new flip progressively harder to achieve, and resulting in progressively more intractable results.

Flip 1: over-reliant on right leg
Flip 2: over-focus on using left leg.
Flip 3: daunting task of regaining right leg.

This is a big yoga lesson: The way to balance an extreme (or an asymmetry, or any other imbalance) isn't to aim for the opposite extreme; but to aim for moderation...integration....mid-point. Otherwise you'll just keep careening between extremes, which results in a vicious cycle. Never aim for infinity (i.e. pedal to the metal). Instead, always aim for viability; for reasonable midpoints.

Your first mistake was the extreme practice (poor self-pacing!) which brought problems. Your second mistake was responding in an extreme way, by completely ceasing practice (rather than heavy self-pacing). And now the third flip is proving particularly difficult. Third flips are always difficult! That's where you ought to start recognizing the traps you've been setting for yourself.

There's a lesson in this, plus a tip as to how to proceed: if you once again eschew moderation (in the literal sense of the word), you'll continue the cycle, and the extremism will get more and more extremey.

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 13 2014 3:49:55 PM
Go to Top of Page

tonightsthenight

846 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  7:55:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Great analogy Jim. Yep, extreme practice is right. I was doing three times the work a busy person should reasonably do.. and I knew it.

So it was reasonable for me to expect the instant karma.

I did slow things down immediately- well in fact I was incapacitated. I have taken care since them to stay within my limits. But as my sense of self came back my sitting practices did not.

The one thing that turns this on its head though: my daily life has become more balanced. So in the end it may turn out that just about any type of regular sitting practice sends me into imbalance. Not so sure that's inaccurate.




Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 13 2014 :  8:47:24 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Sounds like you didn't slow things down...you stopped them. Once again, IMO that was an error (no matter how "incapacitated" you were, you could have done 20, 30 secs of meditation preceded by a few breaths of pranayama). The decision not to was a mirror image of the extreme behavior that got you there. You wanted to be "spiritual", so you totally overdid practice. Then you wanted to feel better, so you totally killed practice. Yogani has written a jillion times about self-pacing, and you ignored it twice, from both directions, opting for black/white rather than shades of grey. You aimed for infinity both times.

As for the balance you happily observe in your daily life now, that's akin to the feeling of relief when I succeeded in my left leg kick-up. Problem solved!

But: no. You are NOT balanced if you can't restart practice (as I wasn't balanced, given my inability to kick from right leg). Both times you got what you wished for, then discovered you'd wished wrong (you'd wished for the extreme opposite of what was happening, rather than a viable midpoint).

I'd suggest rereading my posting, it hasn't fully penetrated (insofar as you're interested in grasping the full breadth of my point; if not, needless to say, please feel completely free to disregard me, as this is just one random online dude's perspective, after all!).

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 13 2014 8:52:58 PM
Go to Top of Page

maheswari

Lebanon
2434 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  02:08:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
no matter how "incapacitated" you were, you could have done 20, 30 secs of meditation preceded by a few breaths of pranayama

very useful i have to remember that when i am overloading
Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  11:15:40 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
maheswari,

I'm fond of how Yogani expresses it: "honor the practice". Great phrase. Never not practice. Drop to nearly nothing....nano-practice if you must. But slamming brakes on full is as extreme (and antithetical to self-pacing) as slamming the accelerator on full. Two big lurches (accelerator/brake) make the third attempted lurch difficult....and if you haven't learned by the third time, I'd imagine the fourth and fifth would be horrendous.

It's all the essence of self-pacing, which is the simplest concept in the world, and Yogani repeats it again and again, yet it seems so devilishly hard for many practitioners to grok....

Don't go all-on. Don't go all-off. Don't shoot for the moon when feeling good. Don't dive into a well when feeling bad. Always, from either side, shoot for a viable median rather than the opposite extreme. If your left leg is awkward, favor that leg a bit in your handstand practice, but don't exclusively shift all focus there (or anywhere else).

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 14 2014 11:21:05 AM
Go to Top of Page

Dogboy

USA
1794 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  12:03:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
It's all the essence of self-pacing, which is the simplest concept in the world, and Yogani repeats it again and again, yet it seems so devilishly hard for many practitioners to grok....

Don't go all-on. Don't go all-off. Don't shoot for the moon when feeling good. Don't dive into a well when feeling bad. Always, from either side, shoot for a viable median rather than the opposite extreme. If your left leg is awkward, favor that leg a bit in your handstand practice, but don't exclusively shift all focus there (or anywhere else).


"Grok" isn't in my dictionary, but love the look of it!

Somehow in my year of AYP I missed the concept of always having two-a-day practice of some duration. Maybe because (knocking on wood) overload hasn't been an issue thus far, other than being a "numbskull" part of the day (which I kind of like actually; it feels like I have my 'yoga hat' on!). Some of my arousal practices get quite intense and I've been foregoing my next sit as a prophylactic. Your suggestion is to do a session of short duration instead of passing over; always do two a day no matter what arises.
Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  12:24:25 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Grok = deeply understand.

FYI, being (unusually) spacey/ditzy is absolutely an overload symptom. You may or may not choose to do practices twice per day as your standard thing to do. But whatever you decide is your standard thing to do, self-pacing is about sticking with it for the long haul and adjusting time length (dramatically, if that's what it takes) if experience in day-to-day life seems "off".

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 14 2014 12:25:04 PM
Go to Top of Page

tonightsthenight

846 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  12:33:19 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Just to clarify folks, I didn't overload on practices. Nor did I completely cease practices after.

I experienced a rash of physical issues during in close succession during a period when I was living in an extremely unbalanced way in daily life.

I recognized my extreme behavior had led to these accidents, and brought much more balance to my daily life.

My inability to maintain consistent or effective practices has more to do with health than anything else. Some wires got cut in the nervous system and I've had to grope around trying to re-wire them. Rather than push back to where I was at before the accident, I've decided to accept where I'm at.

Thanks for your responses, always read thoughtfully and appreciated.

Go to Top of Page

Dogboy

USA
1794 Posts

Posted - Aug 14 2014 :  2:46:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Also, just to clarify, my numb skull isn't a ditzy/spacey feeling but a sensation of (as described) hat-wearing, no doubt from an active pineal gland. But point taken Jim, thanks for your insight.

And TTN, great you're back in the saddle!
Go to Top of Page

maheswari

Lebanon
2434 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  04:02:50 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
thank you for your posts Jim :-)
Go to Top of Page

Ecdyonurus

Switzerland
479 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  04:54:25 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Cannot say much about TNT' post because I did not experience anything similar, sorry. I am sure you will find your way.

Also wanted to thank Jim for his posts - very useful for me since I tend to be all-on or all-of in yoga and in daily life. Hard to accept that middle point is better. But I am learning it through experience in yoga. A insights such as Jim's arr useful as a pointer on the path leading one in a positive direction.
Go to Top of Page

pkj

USA
155 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  09:53:27 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Jim

Agree with the ststement

" being (unusually) spacey/ditzy is absolutely an overload symptom. You may or may not choose to do practices twice per day as your standard thing to do. But whatever you decide is your standard thing to do, self-pacing is about sticking with it for the long haul and adjusting time length (dramatically, if that's what it takes) if experience in day-to-day life seems "off".

thanks

PKJ
Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  12:14:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Ecdyonurus
I tend to be all-on or all-of in yoga and in daily life. Hard to accept that middle point is better.


That's the bhakti that got you here in the first place. It's not a bad thing. But god (or who/whatever....I don't mean to name-drop) gave us brains for a reason. We can use our intelligence and self-awareness to channel bhakti more broadly/wisely, rather than knotting it up in the latest thing which absolutely must happen (including the need to ease of one's need for a thing to happen!).

One thing: "Middle point" is a word without much juice to it. As a goal, it might strike you as a "come down" if you're loaded up with bhakti. "Integration" is a bit juicier. And also probably more accurate (though there are several ways of thinking about this), if you can experience the full richness of the concept. Not left leg. Not right leg. Legs, period

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 17 2014 3:31:58 PM
Go to Top of Page

Ecdyonurus

Switzerland
479 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  12:33:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you Jim! Yes, integration is probably better than middle point.
Go to Top of Page

Jim and His Karma

2110 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  2:42:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Even better than "neither-right-leg-nor-left-leg, just legs, period": how about "everything, period"?

I.e. everything not directly focused on plus everything directly focused on. That's particularly juicy, at least to me.

Edited by - Jim and His Karma on Aug 17 2014 3:33:37 PM
Go to Top of Page

Dogboy

USA
1794 Posts

Posted - Aug 15 2014 :  3:52:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
"Juicy" = another great word!
Go to Top of Page

krcqimpro1

India
329 Posts

Posted - Aug 18 2014 :  07:31:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Tonight and Others,
I have been having a "full plate" of practices, twice a day for years now. I spend nearly 3 hrs in the morning and 2 hrs in the evening everyday,7 days a week. The result has been excellent health, a degree of inner silence (unable to measure) and a degree of energy movement.
All this talk of "overloadind" you guys are having is now getting me worried whether a long-delayed "overloading" (symptoms) is going to hit me hard soon.I checked with Yogani, and he seems to think everything is ok and not to worry.But after reading this thread today my concern has returned.
My question to you guys is: in your experience, what kind of regimen (of practices) would you consider heavy and likely to cause "overloading" ?

Krish

Go to Top of Page

Ecdyonurus

Switzerland
479 Posts

Posted - Aug 18 2014 :  09:05:22 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Krish, I am not an expert but your experience sounds fine so why worry about? Just because somebody writes here that he/she is experiencing overloading, this does not mean that you also should.

That being said, are you sure that you really need such a large amount of practice in order to achieve good results? Have you ever tried to do much less yoga just to see if there is any difference? I say this because some weeks ago I strongly reduced my practice time and I feel better now - in my case, less is more.
Go to Top of Page

BlueRaincoat

United Kingdom
1631 Posts

Posted - Aug 18 2014 :  10:12:54 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Everyone

Krish, I think that is a very good question.

I would go one step further and ask: What causes overload? It appears the amount of practice is not the only factor. And why do some people seem to 'accumulate' overload i.e. they keep adding practices for several years and then it hits them and brings them to an abrupt halt. It's this long-term overload that worries me.

I do experience short-term overload myself and I believe I can spot it and deal with it by adjusting practices very quickly. The million dollar question however is how do you make sure you don't accumulate it/store it for later? Is there anything we can learn from people who have experienced long-term overload? Is there anything you can do early on in your practice to make sure you don't hit a wall in a few years time?

Any thoughts would be very much appreciated.
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 2 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
AYP Public Forum © Contributing Authors (opinions and advice belong to the respective authors) Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.34 seconds. Snitz Forums 2000

 

 

 

Join the Mail List:
News and Events
Near You


AYP PLUS PREVIEW


Direct Downloads

eBooks - PDF, EPUB
and MOBI-KINDLE

FREE eBooks with
MP3 AudioBooks

SAVE  with Bundled
Multi-Title Downloads


Preview
AYP Books

(PDF Books Flyer)

Easy Lessons

Advanced Yoga Practices Book



Spiritual
Adventure Novel

The Secrets of Wilder Novel


Enlightenment Series

Deep Meditation Book


Spinal Breathing Pranayama Book


Tantra Book


Asanas, Mudras & Bandhas Book


Samyama Book


Diet, Shatkarmas and Amaroli Book


Self-Inquiry Book


Bhakti and Karma Yoga Book


Eight Limbs of Yoga Book


Eight Limbs of Yoga Book



Questions & Answers

 

 

Public Home | Plus Home | Main Lessons | Tantra Lessons | Topic Paths | Interviews | Videos | Site Search | Links Section | Testimonials | AYP Survey | Books | Downloads | Contact