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 Satsang Cafe - General Discussions on AYP
 What exactly is the Soul?
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Oct 26 2018 :  08:51:44 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by lalow33

GOT(jonesboy), I'm thinking Game Of Thrones. So, what's everyone's experience as a soul? Is it you that travels around the universe? Is it witnessing for you? Is it the merging? Is it being light? Is it unity?



Hi lalow,

I have given the wrong impression.

If you are traveling you are not being and it is separation, it is still in the local mind.

More like you realize it, then expand to be all things. No place to go because you are already it.

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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1114 Posts

Posted - Oct 27 2018 :  12:10:55 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Dear Jonesboy
Because of our physical location in this world, we call this world local and we called all other worlds that exist in the mind astral but all worlds that we can accesss and take cognizance of , is within mind - I believe; on the screen of our “I AM” , irrespective of what you are identifying your “I” with, the small self or unify with The One. I may be wrong but my reasoning is telling me that if you are cognizant of a world - this one or another - it is still within the same unit, the same Kula, as you termed it.


Sey
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jusmail

India
439 Posts

Posted - Oct 28 2018 :  12:32:41 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry for coming to the party late. Here at AYP, we are very familiar with the phrase: The guru is in you. The corollary to that statement would be: God dwells in us, as us. Ouch, out of the window goes the concept of the soul! As humans we desperately want to cling on to such labels. However, self inquiry eventually reveals that we are the guru, God, consciousness, pure awareness, sat-chit-ananda, unbounded awareness or whatever one may want to call it. www.Swamij.com has a nice mp3 that covers Christianity and non-duality.

Another statement is also worth remembering: The present is now; the future is now; eternity is now. Ouch, out of the window go concepts like past life, karma, birth/death, Judgment Day, purgatory, etc. As humans, it is difficult to give up such labels. Also, we don't know everything outside our perview. Hope these thoughts help!

'Wisdom tells me I am nothing, love tells me I am everything. Between the two, my life flows.' Quotes of Nisargadatta Maharaj
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Oct 29 2018 :  09:12:30 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere

Dear Jonesboy
Because of our physical location in this world, we call this world local and we called all other worlds that exist in the mind astral but all worlds that we can accesss and take cognizance of , is within mind - I believe; on the screen of our “I AM” , irrespective of what you are identifying your “I” with, the small self or unify with The One. I may be wrong but my reasoning is telling me that if you are cognizant of a world - this one or another - it is still within the same unit, the same Kula, as you termed it.


Sey



The Kula, is a KS term to express how one can be and feel everything in the universe within them, as them.

So not sure what you mean by the same kula if you are perceiving a world. Are you more of an AV type saying the world is an illusion and the goal is to realize that?

Edited by - jonesboy on Oct 29 2018 09:57:26 AM
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Oct 29 2018 :  09:17:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by jusmail

Sorry for coming to the party late. Here at AYP, we are very familiar with the phrase: The guru is in you. The corollary to that statement would be: God dwells in us, as us. Ouch, out of the window goes the concept of the soul! As humans we desperately want to cling on to such labels. However, self inquiry eventually reveals that we are the guru, God, consciousness, pure awareness, sat-chit-ananda, unbounded awareness or whatever one may want to call it. www.Swamij.com has a nice mp3 that covers Christianity and non-duality.

Another statement is also worth remembering: The present is now; the future is now; eternity is now. Ouch, out of the window go concepts like past life, karma, birth/death, Judgment Day, purgatory, etc. As humans, it is difficult to give up such labels. Also, we don't know everything outside our perview. Hope these thoughts help!

'Wisdom tells me I am nothing, love tells me I am everything. Between the two, my life flows.' Quotes of Nisargadatta Maharaj




You are confusing Mystical Christianity with the teachings of the church.

Jesus would agree on the point of the present moment.

91. They said to him, "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you." He said to them, "You examine the face of heaven and earth, but you have not come to know the one who is in your presence, and you do not know how to examine the present moment."

My point is, that present moment is much deeper than what one may first think it is.

I agree the guru is in you. I also know that one can have multiple gurus and that there is nothing wrong with getting a little extra help.

34. Jesus said, "If a blind person leads a blind person, both of them will fall into a hole."
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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1114 Posts

Posted - Oct 29 2018 :  10:08:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by jonesboy

quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere

Dear Jonesboy
Because of our physical location in this world, we call this world local and we called all other worlds that exist in the mind astral but all worlds that we can accesss and take cognizance of , is within mind - I believe; on the screen of our “I AM” , irrespective of what you are identifying your “I” with, the small self or unify with The One. I may be wrong but my reasoning is telling me that if you are cognizant of a world - this one or another - it is still within the same unit, the same Kula, as you termed it.


Sey



The Kula, is a KS term to express how one can be and feel everything in the universe within them, as them.

So not sure what you mean by the same kula if you are perceiving a world. Are you more of an AV type saying the world is an illusion and the goal is to realize that?



Ops, Sorry, I may have misunderstood the use of the word. I understood it to mean One World within you, as you, but you mentioned that there are also endless other Worlds created by Buddhas (Pure lands?) that is not within you and not you. So I was thinking that this cannot be.
Not important.

Oh and I am not anything (AV or otherwise) . I am just trying to understand things from my direct experience of them. And that, of course, evolves.

Sey

Edited by - SeySorciere on Oct 29 2018 10:22:06 AM
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lalow33

USA
919 Posts

Posted - Nov 06 2018 :  02:48:23 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
A nice discussion. I still don't know.
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Nov 08 2018 :  10:28:41 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere

quote:
Originally posted by jonesboy

quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere

Dear Jonesboy
Because of our physical location in this world, we call this world local and we called all other worlds that exist in the mind astral but all worlds that we can accesss and take cognizance of , is within mind - I believe; on the screen of our “I AM” , irrespective of what you are identifying your “I” with, the small self or unify with The One. I may be wrong but my reasoning is telling me that if you are cognizant of a world - this one or another - it is still within the same unit, the same Kula, as you termed it.


Sey



The Kula, is a KS term to express how one can be and feel everything in the universe within them, as them.

So not sure what you mean by the same kula if you are perceiving a world. Are you more of an AV type saying the world is an illusion and the goal is to realize that?



Ops, Sorry, I may have misunderstood the use of the word. I understood it to mean One World within you, as you, but you mentioned that there are also endless other Worlds created by Buddhas (Pure lands?) that is not within you and not you. So I was thinking that this cannot be.
Not important.

Oh and I am not anything (AV or otherwise) . I am just trying to understand things from my direct experience of them. And that, of course, evolves.

Sey



I did not mean to give the impression that there is anything that is not within you. We all share the same essence.

Maybe this will help explain things a little better.

It is more like we "bubble up" from emptiness. In the that bubbling up (of potential) process, we manifest in the broader buddhamind space. Kind of like the primordial buddha providing a stable bubble (what we call the universe), so that we can grow and stabilize as a being.

As part of this individual stabilization, everyone becomes "self aware". In this early self aware phase, one becomes attached to various items that they perceive in the stable bubble of buddhamind. This attachment is basis of all of the ego stuff that sentient beings experience.

We have not "fallen" from emptiness based upon any "lack". It is more like we "bubble up" from emptiness. In the that bubbling up (of potential) process, we manifest in the broader buddhamind space. Kind of like the primordial buddha providing a stable bubble (what we call the universe), so that we can grow and stabilize as a being.

As part of this individual stabilization, everyone becomes "self aware". In this early self aware phase, one becomes attached to various items that they perceive in the stable bubble of buddhamind. This attachment is basis of all of the ego stuff that sentient beings experience.

The growth of the individual self aware bubble continues over a very long time. Wisdom starts when one begins to "clear out" all of the underlying ego attachment within the individual self aware bubble. Higher wisdoms comes as one starts to further expand and integrate that self aware bubble into the broader buddhamind space.

When one begins to integrate into buddhamind (3rd & 4th bhumi), the clarity of this buddhamind radiates into the world. That clarity/energy is often called "light". That light though not able to be really seen (as it is clear), can be felt at a subconscious by all beings. Beings are naturally attracted to that light, and hence the beings look to that person radiating for guidance. (hence master-student dynamics)


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SeySorciere

Seychelles
1114 Posts

Posted - Nov 09 2018 :  04:51:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you Jonesboy - now this explanation ties in with my current understanding from various experiences. I was visualizing a stream (straw-like) of consciousness, you are visualizing a bubble. We can work with that.
We still don't have an answer to what the Christian is referring to as " My Soul"


Sey
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Nov 09 2018 :  08:38:54 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by SeySorciere

Thank you Jonesboy - now this explanation ties in with my current understanding from various experiences. I was visualizing a stream (straw-like) of consciousness, you are visualizing a bubble. We can work with that.
We still don't have an answer to what the Christian is referring to as " My Soul"


Sey



I can only speak from a more Mystical Christian view.

That would be realizing the light/rainbow body.

In Eastern Orthodox Christianity realizing the light is called Theosis.
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Blanche

USA
491 Posts

Posted - Nov 10 2018 :  07:43:11 AM  Show Profile  Visit Blanche's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
The question should be “How to realize the soul?” Looking for answers to “What is the soul?” brings only intellectual responses, which are not satisfying, as we all can agree. Information is useful, but it can take one only so far. Blind people do not want just to hear testimonies about how the world looks; they want to heal and see it for themselves. We do not want to just hear things about the soul; we want to see it for ourselves.

As long there are still judgements, as long as it is still separation, there is no clear seeing. “Local mind,” “small self,” “soul,” etc. are all the same One, the Light. There is no meditation and outside-of-meditation – it is only One thing. If this is not obvious, the answer is still on the meditation cushion.

This discussion highlights again the value of practice.
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Dogboy

USA
1489 Posts

Posted - Nov 11 2018 :  10:23:08 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
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jonesboy

USA
568 Posts

Posted - Nov 12 2018 :  09:14:20 AM  Show Profile  Visit jonesboy's Homepage  Reply with Quote  Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Blanche

The question should be “How to realize the soul?”




If you are asking me.. Find a rare guru that can directly share oneness with you, that can help provide the space to let go of issues and fears. That helps move one along to such realizations.

I am sure that view is in the minority..

All the best
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