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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
 Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 09:41:58 AM
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Hi Tempest...
How one defines "God" is entirely individual from my perspective. I may personally define God loosely and the definition may encompass all of known existence whereas someone else may define God as an omnipotent man in the sky. Before anyone could definitively say whether or not God exists we would have to be working from an agreed upon definition of "God."
Love,
Carson |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 09:43:04 AM
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It depends what you mean by "God".
It is often taken for granted that we all know what the word means, but does everyone give it the same meaning? |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 09:45:02 AM
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HI Carson! We cross-posted.  |
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 11:13:44 AM
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From my perspective the meaning of God can change depending on experiences...in childhood as a catholic raised girl I saw God as a bearded man on cloud in the sky.
As a young adult I stopped believing in God and in church as an institute.
On the path of yoga and studying Eastern Philosophy I found Bhakti, a strong desire to be one with, call it God, call it Love, the name is not important, is it inside me or is it All ?
Funny part is, when I am in a church now or hear prayers from youth, I understand them completely different then years ago, the same with the Bible. They touch my heart, they fill me with fire. It is All One Love. My perspective.  
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Edited by - Charliedog on Aug 10 2015 11:35:27 AM |
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Beehive
USA
117 Posts |
Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 2:35:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Charliedog
From my perspective the meaning of God can change depending on experiences...in childhood as a catholic raised girl I saw God as a bearded man on cloud in the sky.
As a young adult I stopped believing in God and in church as an institute.
On the path of yoga and studying Eastern Philosophy I found Bhakti, a strong desire to be one with, call it God, call it Love, the name is not important, is it inside me or is it All ?
Funny part is, when I am in a church now or hear prayers from youth, I understand them completely different then years ago, the same with the Bible. They touch my heart, they fill me with fire. It is All One Love. My perspective.
exactly the same for me....except methodist, not catholic! |
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Dogboy
USA
2197 Posts |
Posted - Aug 10 2015 : 8:21:45 PM
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| To me we are cells in the organism of "GOD", in that way we are all God, so yes I am at one with the All. |
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Radharani
USA
843 Posts |
Posted - Aug 11 2015 : 03:57:44 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tempest
Does anyone here know without any doubt that God exists? I mean does anyone feel at one with God and can say so with complete certainty?
Dear Tempest,
This question, as well as your original one, "is there anyone here who is enlightened?... do you experience any suffering?" both have linguistic problems. This question has been brought up numerous times on the Forum, and Christi and others have already provided excellent answers in this particular thread, but to add my 2 cents:
An important aspect of "enlightenment" is the understanding that this little self, the ego, the "I," is merely a manifestation of the One, Consciousness, or God if you will, manifesting through this little focus of awareness located here and now in space-time. Consciousness at large is experiencing existence in/as/through "you" and "me." The self is kind of a mental construct, an imagination or dream in the mind of God. So who is this "I" and who is asking "me" the question? If God is the only reality than how could a fictional character be "enlightened" when "enlightenment" reveals its fictional nature?
It is an incredible relief not to have to carry around the burden of "the self" as you start to dwell more and more in the divine Source instead of feeling like you have to maintain a facade. Is there still suffering? Well sure, but then who suffers? God is playing at experiencing suffering, and you can feel it, but no need to take it personally. You hurt but it's ok.
Re: the existence of God, this is a big question I've addressed at some length here "Why I Don't Call Myself a Believer," but long story short, the word "exist" can't really be applied to the Source/ Ground of All Existence from which all contingent things emerge. That's the technical theological answer. Also, to "know" with the head and to "know" or feel with the heart are two different things. Yoga is not an intellectual argument.
To know oneness with God on an experiential, heart-felt level is absolute bliss which is independent of external circumstances. This realization is not a distant goal to be attained, but is constantly there in the center of our being. It can be experienced in daily meditative practice which helps us to more and more identify as being an expression of divine Love, until ultimately inner silence, bliss and ecstasy overflows and takes over our entire waking existence.
And yet, life goes on in the ordinary way while we remain in this body and it's all ok, even when it isn't ok from the point of view of the "self," and that's ok too.
Which practices help the most? The ones that work. All techniques are only techniques and not ends in themselves. Some work better than others for different personality types. The system presented here at AYP is pretty solid. Give it a sincere try and see what happens. If another system works better for you, great, go for it.
I hope that makes sense! All the best to you.
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Charliedog
1625 Posts |
Posted - Aug 11 2015 : 04:57:26 AM
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@ Beehive
@ Radharani
quote:
Which practices help the most? The ones that work. All techniques are only techniques and not ends in themselves. Some work better than others for different personality types. The system presented here at AYP is pretty solid. Give it a sincere try and see what happens. If another system works better for you, great, go for it.
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andrew75
26 Posts |
Posted - Aug 28 2015 : 7:14:32 PM
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Returning to Tempest’s initial questions, I can say that Gurunath has inferred in some of his videos and in his book on Babaji that liberation from Earth bound incarnation is attained in the state of Nirvikalpa Samadhi. After this, one is no longer compelled to incarnate in the physical sphere. However, you would still have a significant amount of astral karma so you would have to incarnate in the astral sphere.
The final liberation from all spheres of this cosmic hierarchy is attained in the state of Dharma Megha Samadhi, but this takes forever to attain.
The techniques for attaining Nirvikalpa Samadhi are very special and are only taught orally by an adept or master to a disciple that has already attained a deep state of Savikalpa Samadhi. The only techniques that I’m aware of and are somewhat available to ordinary people like us are the higher kriyas. For example Gurunath would probably teach you these at his ashram in India, but only after you have arduously practiced his first kriya for at least 10 years and you have attained the aforementioned deep state of Savikalpa Samadhi.
After you attain Nirvikalpa Samadhi you no longer experience any suffering or bad things because you no longer have any negative physical karma. At this stage you’d be an adept and you’d have all the answers you seek.
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So-Hi
USA
481 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2015 : 10:24:30 AM
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The higher Kriyas are not needed for this. I and others have reached this much advertised Nirvakalpa Samadhi AKA: THE PULSELESS BREATHLESS STATE. Practicing only the first Kriyas.
When it is your time it happens. The inner guru shows you what to do; there is no need for a secret technique only granted to the chosen.
In fact Kriya is not the only way it can come from the AYP practices as well.
Do not believe all the stories. Be very careful in the Kriya marketplace.
The higher Kriyas as they are promoted are just for extra precise purification if for some reason the first Kriyas are not enough.
quote:
The techniques for attaining Nirvikalpa Samadhi are very special and are only taught orally by an adept or master to a disciple that has already attained a deep state of Savikalpa Samadhi. The only techniques that I’m aware of and are somewhat available to ordinary people like us are the higher kriyas.
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andrew75
26 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2015 : 3:17:18 PM
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In his book on Kriya Yoga Hariharananda said that only the fifth and sixth kriyas can lead to Nirvikalpa Samadhi. Hariharananda himself attained it at the age of 41 after practicing the higher kriyas in isolation for 10 years.
I did not say that these techniques are secret; I only said that they are special. They are certainly not for everyone and although not impossible, it is quite difficult to get learn them from a reliable source, especially the fifth or sixth ones.
I also never said that Kriya is the only way. I said these kriyas are the only techniques that I’m aware of and I know for sure can lead to Nirvikalpa Samadhi.
I also never said that I believe all irrelevant stories, but Hariharananda and Gurunath are certainly excellent sources of information.
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So-Hi
USA
481 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2015 : 8:23:09 PM
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Yes Hariharananda was Amazing.
Gurunath well have not met him.
quote:
Originally posted by andrew75
In his book on Kriya Yoga Hariharananda said that only the fifth and sixth kriyas can lead to Nirvikalpa Samadhi. Hariharananda himself attained it at the age of 41 after practicing the higher kriyas in isolation for 10 years.
I did not say that these techniques are secret; I only said that they are special. They are certainly not for everyone and although not i
mpossible, it is quite difficult to get learn them from a reliable source, especially the fifth or sixth ones.
I also never said that Kriya is the only way. I said these kriyas are the only techniques that I’m aware of and I know for sure can lead to Nirvikalpa Samadhi.
I also never said that I believe all irrelevant stories, but Hariharananda and Gurunath are certainly excellent sources of information.
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Edited by - So-Hi on Aug 29 2015 8:34:40 PM |
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So-Hi
USA
481 Posts |
Posted - Aug 29 2015 : 8:56:59 PM
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Feel the need to clarify something because this talk of Paramahamsa Hariharananda may lead those from other Kriya traditions to confusion.
Paramahamsa Hariharananda taught his version of Kriya. The techniques are not the same as other lineages. In his System there are 6 Stages but this is not true of the lineages that are directly from the Lahiri Family and others.
Perhaps the book does say that, and perhaps it is true or untrue it does not matter.
When I share that this can be done with the first Kriyas that is true. It was also shared that at some point the inner Guru steps in and shows you what to do.
This is not in an imaginative form of a person it happens during deep practice and you intuit what to do this comes from the stillness. This is the only important part.
The Stillness can be reached via AYP there is no need to rely on anything but your own practice. To each there own and that goes for beliefs also.
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technoyogi
Canada
158 Posts |
Posted - Oct 23 2015 : 03:12:36 AM
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The artist and the art are one Tempest  |
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MrCuddly
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - Oct 24 2015 : 2:45:59 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tempest
Does anyone here know without any doubt that God exists? I mean does anyone feel at one with God and can say so with complete certainty?
Whether God exists or not depends on your definition of God. But if God is really omni-present than any definition would be false since nothing can be excluded or added to everything.
What stands between atheists and theists are basically definitions. Better to start with thoroughly understanding yourself and thus the amazing potential of the human mind and physiology. And that will open other doors.
You can only really do that with practice and by following the right processes - but you've come to the right place! |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Oct 27 2015 : 4:30:40 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tempest
Does anyone here know without any doubt that God exists? I mean does anyone feel at one with God and can say so with complete certainty?
Yes. Simple as that. :) |
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BillinL.A.
USA
375 Posts |
Posted - Oct 27 2015 : 5:46:46 PM
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| If in the drama of life circumstances demand it I want to follow you into the battle of Life Emc of Ayp...(you Joan of Arc you!) |
Edited by - BillinL.A. on Oct 27 2015 6:15:56 PM |
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emc
2072 Posts |
Posted - Oct 28 2015 : 03:40:14 AM
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| Thanks for the morning laughter, Billin |
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BillinL.A.
USA
375 Posts |
Posted - Oct 28 2015 : 10:47:01 AM
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| emc! |
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anirvachaniya
USA
4 Posts |
Posted - Apr 04 2016 : 6:57:06 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Tempest
I was wondering is there anyone here who is enlightened/liberated/ in nirvikalpa or sahaja samadhi?
If so, what practices do you feel most helped you reach this state of consciousness
and
what is life for you like now? Do you experience any suffering?
I thought this was a bit funny because: do you think an enlightened person, by your own standards let's say, would come out and say, "Hey everyone! Yeah! I'm enlightened!" That sort of attitude precedes that sort of answer?
And as far as people commenting on it, saying this and that, seems like they're drawing from sources other than the original source itself, which I find 100% unreliable. Intellectual activists.
Why do you ask? |
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FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Apr 05 2016 : 2:04:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by anirvachaniya
I thought this was a bit funny because: do you think an enlightened person, by your own standards let's say, would come out and say, "Hey everyone! Yeah! I'm enlightened!" That sort of attitude precedes that sort of answer?
Why do you assume announcing one's progress and achievement has to come from a bombastic attitude? That sort of attitude would make that sort of answer a lie. That doesn't mean that sort of an answer should have that sort of an attitude. I can perfectly imagine myself announcing it to my loved ones so that they are motivated. If I could fly, I would fly and try to motivate them. |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Apr 05 2016 : 7:47:14 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by FakeYogi
quote:
Originally posted by anirvachaniya
I thought this was a bit funny because: do you think an enlightened person, by your own standards let's say, would come out and say, "Hey everyone! Yeah! I'm enlightened!" That sort of attitude precedes that sort of answer?
Why do you assume announcing one's progress and achievement has to come from a bombastic attitude? That sort of attitude would make that sort of answer a lie. That doesn't mean that sort of an answer should have that sort of an attitude. I can perfectly imagine myself announcing it to my loved ones so that they are motivated. If I could fly, I would fly and try to motivate them.
It's not the attitude (necessarily) that is the issue here FakeYogi. To claim that you have achieved enlightenment is to say that there is no more progress to be made... a sure-fire way to ensure that no more progress is made.  There is always more conditioning to drop, more tendencies to become aware of, more blockages to work through... there is no end. To anything. Literally. 
When we begin walking the path it is usually quite easy to suss out the areas we need to grow in. As we continue to walk the path, the areas that need work become subtler and subtler and more difficult to suss out. Oftentimes people will get to a point where it has been a long time since they have found anything to actively work on dropping, surrendering to, increasing awareness of, etc. Sometimes people arrive at this point and claim "enlightenment." Sometimes people will land here, start teaching, and stop inquiring into their own blind spots. This almost always (from my perspective) ends up in some sort of inappropriate guru situation. So, in my opinion, people are right to not claim enlightenment, even if by many others' perspectives they are. In claiming enlightenment you are taking a(t least a subtle) stance in which you are (at least partially) blocking yourself off from further growth. Most people who get to the point where others would call them enlightened, realize that there is no final enlightenment, there is always more path to walk, and choose to just put their head down and keep trekking the path.
That's my perspective anyway.
Love,
Carson |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Apr 06 2016 : 04:20:14 AM
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Well said Carson. I share your point of view.
And if we consider that we are all one, can any one be completely enlightened before everyone else is? It's a long, long journey for all of us. |
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FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Apr 06 2016 : 1:28:06 PM
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Carson & BlueRaincoat,
A counter-argument was already posted earlier in this thread that Buddha seemingly attained a complete state of realization needing no further progress. I will also paste a quote from Swami Vivekananda's book on Yoga Sutras where he wrote in the introductory chapter:
"Another theory in modern times has been presented by several schools, that man’s destiny is to go on always improving, always struggling towards, and never reaching, the goal. This statement, though, apparently, very nice, is also absurd, because there is no such thing as motion in a straight line. Every motion is in a circle. If you could take up a stone, and project it into space, and then live long enough, that stone would come back exactly to your hand. A straight line, infinitely projected, must end in a circle. Therefore, this idea that the destiny of man is progression ever forward and forward, and never stopping, is absurd. " |
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sunyata
USA
1507 Posts |
Posted - Apr 06 2016 : 1:54:22 PM
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| It's true that everything is perfect as it is. Some even say there is no need for spiritual practices because everyone is already Enlightened. Some may say it from experience, some from mental understanding. When there is Joy in the journey, progress becomes secondary. |
Edited by - sunyata on Apr 06 2016 1:55:26 PM |
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Is anyone here enlightened/liberated?
