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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
 Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 12:55:56 PM
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I have been meditating using AYP system for 8 months already but I didn't have any fantastic results, now I'm of thinking trying TM, do you think that is a good idea, what is your opinion on TM?
I'm not saying AYP is not a good meditation, it just hasn't worked that well for me.
Meditations are always good, very good, enjoyable, I feel love (that's exactly what i fell, love!). But I don't think I've gotten some actual results in an everyday life. Maybe I have some small benefits but those may not be due to DM. |
Edited by - Sungazer on Nov 13 2014 12:58:04 PM |
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Mykal K
Germany
266 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 1:44:05 PM
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Hi Sungazer,
I have been in TM before switching naturally to breath meditation 12 years ago.
To me it felt the same so i stayed with the breath.
Switch came after a few months.
Ayp's DM and TM are pretty similar, main and maybe only difference is in the mantra being used.
There is a documentary on Maharishi (and hence on TM) on this forum, check it out if you havent already.
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 2:20:53 PM
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Thanks, I have heard a lot about TM yet, can you link that documentary?
Difference is mantra, yes, but I think that's not so little difference, because everybody gets the mantra that works best for him (or at least I think so), and that's why I think TM would work better for me.
I think that "I am" mantra is a very universal one that works for everyone, and that's why Yogani's put it into practice, because it works for everyone; in TM i hope I will get the mantra that will work specifically good for me, and hopefully get better results.
That's at least what I think.
So you've been first into TM, then into just a basic breath meditation and then AYP? |
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Mykal K
Germany
266 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 3:29:35 PM
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quote:
because everybody gets the mantra that works best for him (or at least I think so), and that's why I think TM would work better for me.
 You should look at the documentary.
Yes, I have been first into TM. Shortly after that I came across Osho - he became a major influence on my path. From what I understood from him I took it that mantra meditation is inferior to breath, and since I had spontaneous switching to breath in my meditations, I ditched the mantra.
I went into my own style of zazen (not so rigid in posture as some schools do it) and I have also used wing chun form for meditation. Stayed with that till I came to AYP I think two years ago. |
Edited by - Mykal K on Nov 13 2014 3:30:43 PM |
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Dogboy
USA
2197 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 5:56:06 PM
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Hello Sungazer
After putting in months of AYP it might be worthwhile to try the enhancement:
http://www.aypsite.org/116.html |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 6:50:54 PM
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Thanks Dogboy, I will try but I don't believe I'm am yet ready for it, I don't even practice Pranayama, I was practicing it for a few months and then it started causing me to overload.
I think that I am a special case, lol, my nervous system needs much more cleaning.... |
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Dogboy
USA
2197 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 7:19:15 PM
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| Good for you for being cautious! Stay meditating one way or another. If you take anything from AYP it is honor your inner guru. I send my blessings |
Edited by - Dogboy on Nov 13 2014 7:20:38 PM |
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Anima
484 Posts |
Posted - Nov 13 2014 : 8:15:59 PM
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Namaste
Dear Sungazer,
I'm really overload prone, too. But I do think meditation is helping. I've spent the better part of two years practicing here. I've had periods using more "free form" meditation (siting by the river, chanting at temple, playing flute, dance).
Here's a lesson on free form vs. structured practice. I think the point of it is that some modification is fine. Personally, I say go for it if you wan to try some TM. But read for yourself, if you like:
http://www.aypsite.org/202.html
Hari m |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Nov 14 2014 : 12:02:23 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anima Deorum
Namaste
Dear Sungazer,
I'm really overload prone, too. But I do think meditation is helping. I've spent the better part of two years practicing here. I've had periods using more "free form" meditation (siting by the river, chanting at temple, playing flute, dance).
Here's a lesson on free form vs. structured practice. I think the point of it is that some modification is fine. Personally, I say go for it if you wan to try some TM. But read for yourself, if you like:
http://www.aypsite.org/202.html
Hari m
what do you mean by "overload prone"? what do you include in your free form meditation? when has it became to work for you? |
Edited by - Sungazer on Nov 14 2014 12:18:37 PM |
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Anima
484 Posts |
Posted - Nov 14 2014 : 9:03:03 PM
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Dear Sungazer,
quote:
Originally posted by Sungazerwhat do you mean by "overload prone"? what do you include in your free form meditation? when has it became to work for you?
I just mean that I am very sensitive emotionally, mentally, and energetically. I have to take practices slowly and be careful with self-pacing.
Over most of the summer, I would simply go by the river in the park and sit by it. I would often dip my feet in and dab my forehead with its cool water. Mostly, I just meditated without mantra or breathing. It might be more like grounding, but I actually felt it help me to expand.
Other times, I would walk by the river and chant or say prayers I learned. I also just sat under a tree sometimes and meditated with my fingers in the soil by its roots. I played my flute by the river a lot. I sat on the wooden deck and spoke with my friends. A lot of it was just letting the process do what it needed to do.
Well, I think meditation is working for me now, which is the most important time! I believe it will continue to help. Honestly, I never thought I would be so grateful for such simple things I have in my life. The blessings can "sneak up" on us in a very good way.
So, I'm thinking it can work in your direction, as well. I hope so. Please feel free to share how your practice continues and benefits you!
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Edited by - Anima on Nov 14 2014 9:05:14 PM |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Nov 14 2014 : 9:20:26 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Anima Deorum
Over most of the summer, I would simply go by the river in the park and sit by it. I would often dip my feet in and dab my forehead with its cool water. Mostly, I just meditated without mantra or breathing. It might be more like grounding, but I actually felt it help me to expand.
Other times, I would walk by the river and chant or say prayers I learned. I also just sat under a tree sometimes and meditated with my fingers in the soil by its roots. I played my flute by the river a lot. I sat on the wooden deck and spoke with my friends. A lot of it was just letting the process do what it needed to do.
There it is...just B-E-I-N-G and D-O-I-N-G.
If meditation isn't enhancing the being and doing, it ain't worth it. |
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adishivayogi
USA
197 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 08:20:35 AM
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| imo there is no yoga without pranayama unless kundalini is already near its full expression in the human body. thats the reason people who have been using tm for decades have not gone into samadhi while someone doing ayp, kriya have experinced it within 5 or so years. besides tm is just ayp minus the spinal breathing. so you're giving up spinal breathing by switching to tm and not getting anything else. i believe a better option would be to keep spinal breathing, maybe even take focus higher than bhrum, perhaps bindu v or even bregma. and if in some months you still arent happy id switch to a concentration based meditation. i focus on bregma and listen to omkar and it is very intense |
Edited by - adishivayogi on Nov 16 2014 08:51:14 AM |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4370 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 09:05:48 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
I have been meditating using AYP system for 8 months already but I didn't have any fantastic results, now I'm of thinking trying TM, do you think that is a good idea, what is your opinion on TM?
I'm not saying AYP is not a good meditation, it just hasn't worked that well for me.
Meditations are always good, very good, enjoyable, I feel love (that's exactly what i fell, love!). But I don't think I've gotten some actual results in an everyday life. Maybe I have some small benefits but those may not be due to DM.
Hi Sungazer,
8 months is a very short period of time to be practising meditation. People can often practice for several years before experiencing positive result in their lives outside of practice time. The fact that you are already having the experience of love in your sittings is a very good sign.
If you are keen to speed up your evolution then simply follow through the main lessons in order and you will be guided as to what to do next with each additional practice. The next step is Spinal Breathing which you mention you have already tried with signs of overload arising. If you had problems with 10 minutes, try 5, or 2, or if even that is too much then try just a few breaths up and down before beginning meditation practice. Gradually your subtle body will purify and you will find you can increase the number of breaths and the number of minutes of practice each day.
After that the next steps would be to add on the various locks and mudras. Adding asana practice on to the front end of your yoga routine makes a big difference, even if it is only for a few minutes each day. So gradually you can build up a more full practice, which will cause your subtle nervous system to open up and expand. Eventually you will come to the mantra enhancements and to samyama and the bastrikas and khumbakas but that could take several years depending on the rate of progress you are able to make.
Switching to a different mantra (TM) at this stage could actually be a step backwards. It takes time to get used to a particular mantra and for it to settle in and if we change it, we have to go through the process again from the beginning.
Simply practicing meditation on it's own is not a very fast way to get enlightened. It is the slow road to China. That is why meditation is covered from lesson 13 to lesson 37. The next 397 lessons are devoted mainly to other aspects of the awakening process of yoga.
One other point: If you are able to sit twice each day with the feeling of love inside you, eventually this will begin to spill over into the rest of your life outside of practices. It will also begin to change your body as the heart expands more and more.... So that is definitely something to be cultivated.
Enjoy!
Christi |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 09:07:50 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
I have been meditating using AYP system for 8 months already but I didn't have any fantastic results, now I'm of thinking trying TM, do you think that is a good idea, what is your opinion on TM?
There are several reasons why your meditation may not have the result you hoped for. It is perfectly possible to change the mantra without noticing any extra benefits. 8 months is not a long time as mediation practice goes.
If you must rule out the unsuitability of the mantra by all means try the TM one. But remember TM stops at meditation. As Adishivayogi has already pointed out, with AYP you'd have many more strings to your bow.
Have you tried adding a little spinal breathing before meditation? That can deepen your mediation and you might see results faster. |
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Christi
United Kingdom
4370 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 09:49:16 AM
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Hi Blue,
We cross posted. |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 10:35:39 AM
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Hi Cristi
Yes, and very much along the same lines  |
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NewbieGG
Bulgaria
52 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 11:41:55 AM
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Hi Sungazer , try to lessen the expectations , this is not a race . When you sit to meditate do it just for the sake of these 15-20 minutes peace and joy. Expecting anything is great obstacle. If nothing is happening- you are not ready ,simple as that
To awaken kundalini in unprepared body is not a nice thing , ask me about that...So instead of searching for powerful mantra take your time and give your system a good clean .Yoga asanas or exercise, vegan eating , pure speech , thoughts, acts .
Good luck 
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Edited by - NewbieGG on Nov 16 2014 11:44:18 AM |
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ak33
Canada
229 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 12:02:24 PM
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Hi Sungazer,
I was an AYP practitioner for 1 and half year. Due to severe overloading problems, as a result of which I could only meditate for 7 minutes a day (seemed completely useless to me), I switched to buddhist shamatha meditation (mindfulness of breath). There are many differences between AYP and shamatha, contact me if you want more information. |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 12:25:20 PM
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Good point about switching mantras, Christi.
On that note, it's important to recognize that the mantra in itself is not some magical charm, though it does acquire charm-like qualities the more refined it becomes. As Yogani has said, any word(s) can be refined into deep legels of stillness...banana, cheesecake, hocus pocus, whatever. The "i am" mantra and its enchancements are seed sounds that resonate acoustically well in key regions and directions in the nervous system. Therefore, they are optimal for refinement.
The magic is in the easily favoring. |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 5:55:11 PM
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Okay, thanks for ALL the answers :)
I will try some SBP again, just a couple of minutes this time. And now, I meditate 3 times a day, per 15 minutes, is that okay? Because it always takes me to much to rest from meditation, it's never enough, if I meditate for 20 minutes I could rest for more than half an hour, really!
And, well, I think that 8 months for DM is a lot, most people gets much benefits in 8 months.
And, here's the thing about me, that's why it still hasn't work. I'm actually emotionally empty, I can't find pleasure in anything, and I have bad social skills. Just wanted to say it, so that you know why it isn't working for me...
And, are you so sure that TM wouldn't work better? That it is almost the same as DM? As I said already, and this is what really interests me... how do you get the mantra, based on what does teacher give you a certain mantra? (do you Mykal K know?). The fact is, everybody gets different mantra in TM, why maybe because a certain one will work best for them? And how does teacher choose it, by doing some ritaul (of which I've heard are being done while on a course), or does he somehow conclude what is best mantra for you?
Maybe Yogani choosed "I am" because it works for everyone, but it may take more time for someone (like me). I've heard that people often get allmost instant results in TM, they fall in trance on the course. Maybe that's due to those rituals teacher do on a course. To bad they don't wanna speak about it, so that new commers wouldn't see it is a spiritual cult! :D
What Yoga asanas can you recommend me? Can I find just some basic ones on YouTube?
@ak33, what were you results in shamatha? |
Edited by - Sungazer on Nov 16 2014 6:07:00 PM |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 8:32:22 PM
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Hi Sungazer,
without knowing first hand, it seems like TM mantras are given randomly or by intuition and feel of someone who most probably has not reached the goal of yoga.
The reason for good experiences in TM initiations may come from the group effect of sitting together diving into meditation with the mantra.
In the end you may need to find out yourself :P
Peace friend and happy practice with whatever works :) |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Nov 16 2014 : 9:28:13 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
And, here's the thing about me, that's why it still hasn't work. I'm actually emotionally empty, I can't find pleasure in anything, and I have bad social skills. Just wanted to say it, so that you know why it isn't working for me...
You are a child of God. You are a divine being. You have the potential to do great things. Know That. Become That. |
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Sungazer
Croatia
61 Posts |
Posted - Nov 18 2014 : 09:08:42 AM
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| Thank you for support :) |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Nov 18 2014 : 09:44:32 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sungazer
And, are you so sure that TM wouldn't work better? That it is almost the same as DM?
I personally don't think I'd gain anything by moving from AYP meditation to TM. The reason is this: there is a fair amount of research on mantra meditation and it seems that it is the process that counts the most. I remember somebody once saying you can meditate on Coca-Cola - you will still get results as long as you follow the procedure.
It wouldn't do any harm you trying TM (though I hear it is rather expensive) if you really must convince yourself, but if you stay on the path I think sooner or later you will need to other AYP methods and enhanced mantras (I have got to the point myself where the first mantra started to feel too short and I needed an enhancement - TM wouldn't have helped me with that).
Best wishes |
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kensbikes100
USA
192 Posts |
Posted - Feb 24 2015 : 9:44:31 PM
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When I decided to return to meditation I restarted TM, but I didn't like that it had no connection to my asana practice. AYP offers a wide range of associated options and Yogani has offered a unified perspective.
Also the process of changing Mantras was not straightforward or easy. I do not want to just go back and forth. I think it is not worth it to seek the perfect mantra. Seek peace in your practice instead. |
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Switching to TM
