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mr_anderson
USA
734 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 27 2012 : 4:59:03 PM
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| thank you for the update :-) |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Sep 15 2012 : 3:28:32 PM
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it seems i am heading that way too...
since last june i had very strong overload...dry mouth..anxiety..few panic attacks (that i would witness calmly!)...feeling energy /heat/sweat in the lower spine...electricity in legs and arms...weird digestive system...sadness...i cut all my practices
early july i tried few minutes of SBP and DM...soon i overloaded again...so stopped again all practices
early august i started 10 min of breath meditation .. last week i increased the time to become 15 min of breath meditation....which lead to overload ...so i stopped breath meditation yesterday.....
my inner guru is telling me no practices at all
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jean
Germany
107 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2012 : 7:46:23 PM
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From my experience the body needs some time to adjust to the higher energies running around in the system.
Until the body has adapted it can't take more energy in or weird symptoms start to appear.
I started again with the mantra meditation since a few weeks but without pranayama for now.
The time-frame where I couldn't do any practices was about 6 month but this depends on the individual I guess.
Be safe folks 
EDIT:
I have to add that the lower body feels now more conductive and it seems now easier to ground myself. |
Edited by - jean on Sep 18 2012 8:29:00 PM |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2012 : 01:28:50 AM
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| thx for sharing Jean...over here it seems that no practices is also gona be for several months at least |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 27 2012 : 07:03:32 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by maheswari
thx for sharing Jean...over here it seems that no practices is also gona be for several months at least
Hi Maheswari,
I have not practiced AYP for a year and a half now. Any practice of any kind can cause overload here very easily. The symptoms you mention are all for sure signs of overload and in my case and having many of those as well, including other severe experiences, it was a loud and clear message to stop. I had a strong tendency to be doing all kinds of practices, some I wasn't aware of until it became obvious that even the slightest efforts to free myself were counter productive. This has included stopping all inquiry and tantra as well.
So living normally has been the way to go, doing nothing other than simply "seeing" or "hearing" what arises without wanting or avoiding. The way it is seen here is that the mind can't be used to dissolve itself, just seeing without touching or doing something is enough for whatever remains to wind itself down.
There is a point to which formal practices are very helpful, but after a point, from my point of view, they no longer contribute to balance and in fact can do the opposite. Life has to be lived and experienced fully, meditation in my life created a cushion which was very welcome and very helpful for a while. After this, stage, when enough balance has returned, it is time to walk out with the weeds and see and hear all the little tendencies that are still active. To feel the emotional and physical world fully.
Life is the teacher and in the end, all we have to do is listen and just be. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Sep 27 2012 : 3:15:56 PM
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Hi Anthem11
few days ago the overload stopped...it took me this time 2 weeks to recover.... the overload this time had new components: paranoia,doubting myself and my ability to do routine things,feeling totally spaced out
plus the usual package extreme fatigue...eyes shutting down...feeling that the energy is tearing your body and driving you nuts..like a walking corpse...in short overload is hell
i have learned my lesson ...for 3 times i tried to resume practices and for 3 times i ended up overloading for weeks
quote:
So living normally has been the way to go, doing nothing other than simply "seeing" or "hearing" what arises without wanting or avoiding
well this is enquiry...enquiry while living normally.... this is happening over here too....yesterday there was a "seeing" of a beautiful tree...astonishing beauty....people are missing out so much,missing out the direct seeing of beauty that is available right here right now....
as you said i think that formal practices are very useful...but then there is a point one spontaneously leaves them behind.... you climb the ladder step by step,but in order to be on the roof (and have the complete view) one has to leave the ladder behind......
anyway...nothing is for sure....maybe will need to have formal practices again at some point...and maybe not...i dont know ....and this is the beauty in all of it |
Edited by - maheswari on Sep 27 2012 3:17:31 PM |
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elgadaniel
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Nov 03 2012 : 02:46:31 AM
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Hi Anthem,
I think you did the right thing, the perfect action…
You will have to experience some negativity & pain in order to purify…………This applies to nutrition, fasting, spiritual practices, etc..
I don't think there is a way to not experience detoxification & cleansing reactions…….
If there is, I would love to learn it…
What is most important is that you never became dysfunctional……
If we lived in monasteries and we didn't have to support ourselves,
maybe you could push the envelope a little bit more.
It doesn't matter that you can't meditate…………After all, you only meditate to eliminate your karma & blocks.
You seem to still be doing that………And your meditation time has been freed up for other activities…..
I wish i was as wise and lucky as you are.
warm regards,
Daniel |
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elgadaniel
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Nov 04 2012 : 2:45:47 PM
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Hi members,
Gosh, so many people seem to be experiencing overloads & kundalini syndromes,
regardless of the spiritual practice…………
It can be transcendental meditation, AYP, certain qigongs, microcosmic, you name it.
Aren't there any practices that a person can do daily without becoming dysfunctional?
I wonder if folks are becoming dysfunctional from merely doing deep 3 part breathing without retention?
alternate nostril breathing?……….kapalabhati?
There must be a practice one can do where impurities come out
without opening the highest centers or becoming depressed, drowsy……..
Perhaps our diet needs to drastically cleaned up and we must be free of tobacco, marajuana, etc
before starting up?..
Maybe we should merely concentrate on the front of the body?…………or only try to create a downward flow?
Gosh, i am frustrated & baffled……
I don't know what those practices are, but I hope somebody will discover it soon…….
Im grateful that this forum exists……..Otherwise we wouldn't even notice these overloads.
We would assume everyone is going to heaven.
Daniel |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2012 : 08:08:53 AM
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No you don't want to make major lifestyle changes; that could make things worse.
Overload is from progressing too fast. There is not a problem with the practices. You can cut all the way back to just meditation if necessary, and if that's too much only do grounding.
We propel ourselves along the path and devotion and spiritual thoughts speed us up.
If you can't find a practice that doesn't overload, then cut out all practices because you are achieving what they were designed for without them.
See how you are overloading on any practice, and yet you have this voracious appetite for finding the perfect practice? Those are signs that you should be cutting back further, not doing more practices. |
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yogani
USA
5195 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2012 : 11:28:14 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by elgadaniel
There must be a practice one can do where impurities come out
without opening the highest centers or becoming depressed, drowsy……
Hi elgadaniel:
It is a sign of the times, a global phenomenon. Everyone is becoming more spiritually sensitive. It is much different now than it was only a few decades ago.
Is there a simple solution? Is there a one-size-fits-all practice routine that will give everyone good progress with comfort and safety? It seems to be so less and less. But it is not an unmanageable situation. In fact, effective "self-directed practice" offers the possibility for more progress with less instability, assuming we are prudent in our approach. It boils down to individual responsibility.
There was a time when the spiritual air was thick, there were few tools available, and little possibility to make significant spiritual strides in a single lifetime. Now the tools are plentiful, the spiritual air is clearing for much quicker openings, and the striding must be measured. The ride is much faster and a lot can be accomplished in one lifetime, especially for those who sense the opportunity, step up, and do what is necessary.
It is the same for everyone, whether practicing in a tradition, a non-traditional teaching (like AYP), or no structured teaching at all (where we are often seeing quick bhakti-only-driven awakenings). What we all have in common is that we are more spiritually susceptible, less practice will often be more, and the need for self-pacing and grounding has increased.
Also, keep in mind that this is a support forum where people come for help with issues they are having on their path, and this may not be representative of all practitioners out there. For every practitioner checking in here, there may be thousands out there who we never see. Nevertheless, the increasing sensitivities are quite evident and we are doing all we can to provide useful knowledge and good tools for practitioners to navigate their own path.
There are three lessons that sum up under-sensitivity (we see that too) and over-sensitivity to deep meditation, with a discussion on the overall trend toward more sensitivity and suggestions on measures to consider. They are Lessons 365-367 beginning here: http://www.aypsite.org/365.html
This is not the only place sensitivity issues are discussed. It comes up again and again throughout the lessons, with many suggestions and nuances covered on navigating the path of causes and effects in practice according to individual experiences that are occurring. Everyone is a bit different in this, resulting in many variations in fine-tuning according to individual need. We should not assume it is going to be the same for everyone. With regard to practices, one size does not fit all.
So it is suggested not to shy away from practices because someone else finds it necessary to do so at a particular place on their path. Find out what the balance in practices is for you, and evolve with it. It is reasonably safe if you self-pace, keep active in daily life, and do not take things to the extreme. The optional incremental application of the baseline system of practices in AYP is designed for that kind of approach.
One thing that is key in all of this is the cultivation of abiding inner silence (witness), which is the province of meditation. With the arising of the presence of unshakable inner awareness, kundalini events become much more tolerable and manageable, and the doors gradually open to advanced applications of awareness, such as samyama and relational (in stillness) self-inquiry. As these later stages evolve, accompanied by much more refined purification and opening in the subtle neurobiology, the previous energy (kundalini) episodes, if any, become much less overwhelming, and a normal aspect of rising ecstatic bliss and divine flow in everyday living.
So keep at it, whatever "it" is for you. 
All the best!
The guru is in you.
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2012 : 11:38:07 AM
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Reading Yogani's words is like finding water after wandering in the desert, parched for thirst. I'm not trying to be overly laudatory, but I speak from the heart.  |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Nov 05 2012 : 10:41:57 PM
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Keep up the practice friends! Yogani is so far advanced and still keeps practicing. There are other masters who also keep up the practice as there is no end to this!
Self pacing is needed in every kind of practice or spiritual system. The more effective one technique/system is, the higher the chance for instability along the path. The less effective the practice is, the more you can overdo without problems. Singing bhajans for hours won't cause any trouble for most people while 1-2 hours of DM should overload 99,x% of all practitioners extremely =P
Yet don't give up so fast and don't be cheated by mindly estimations about needing and not needing etc. Continue the practice and self pace as needed. Some more observations of this body mind regarding this topic in another thread: http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....PIC_ID=12053
Happy practicing! :) |
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SparklingDiamond
Australia
227 Posts |
Posted - Nov 06 2012 : 01:29:43 AM
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Hi Yogani
Thanks for sharing all that valuable info.
The time does feel ripe. It's so intense this year. I have felt it from the start of the year. Everything seems to have 'reved up' more.
All the stuff 'swept under the carpet' is now free flowing. :) And omigosh, it's so difficult ! But I understand. This is the year! 2012 ! Of course, it wasn't going to be a walk in the park kinda year, by any means.
I use to be able to practise my meditation, and it was a 'salve' for life issues. It was like putting a band aid on it.
But ever since going deeper into meditation and SB, the volume of transformation suddenly got turned way up in intensity. So I have shyed away somewhat from my meditation practises, scared of the overload. I have started back into again now, but on a slower footing, this time.
I have often thought with all the pitfalls, trials and tribulations life can throw at us, that THANK GOD! Meditation exists - to help us on our path back up the mountain, because, sometimes, pure and simple, Life can be tremendously difficult.
****There was a time when the spiritual air was thick, there were few tools available, and little possibility to make significant spiritual strides in a single lifetime. Now the tools are plentiful, the spiritual air is clearing for much quicker openings, and the striding must be measured. The ride is much faster and a lot can be accomplished in one lifetime, especially for those who sense the opportunity, step up, and do what is necessary.****
Thanks for reminding us to stay focused and motivated.
Maria
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SparklingDiamond
Australia
227 Posts |
Posted - Nov 06 2012 : 01:35:13 AM
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Holy
Thank you for sharing that!!
I didn't realize how powerful meditation could truly be, it unblocks all that has been kept under wraps, and brings it to the 'light of day'. Not easy, but there is so much to be gained. One needs the courage of a lion....or a lioness....to stay with such powerful practises as those here on AYP!
Blessings,
Maria |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 06 2012 : 02:23:44 AM
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dear Holy
just some pointers:
quote:
Yogani is so far advanced and still keeps practicing. There are other masters who also keep up the practice as there is no end to this!
we dont know what masters do or do not do...and it is not important...we dont compare ourselves to anyone not even to masters...each one is different...the important thing is that we take care of our own practice (or no practice in case of overload)
quote:
Singing bhajans for hours won't cause any trouble for most people
also this not correct...singing bhajans stears bhakti and this is as stimulating as over doing sitting practices like dm etc...
so the best advice again is: each one has to see for him/her self..there is no 1 size for all...practice,find out for yr own what suits you and be wise
TGIIY |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 06 2012 : 6:45:06 PM
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Who knows if there is any such thing as a master? Correct me if I'm wrong, but does Yogani call himself one?
He is certainly more knowledgable, more dedicated, more experienced, more valuable, and more practiced than me.
In my profession I am called a "master electrician", but I think it is bull crap.
I am very experienced in several different areas, but nobody knows everything. I learn new things every month or two. The words are misleading. There should be a word for "one of the few most experienced people".
"Master" carries a connotation that someone knows it all and has no further to go. The areas of expertise that can be mastered are quite simple, and often not worth mentioning, like "I am a master at using a spoon". |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 02:00:20 AM
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| wise words Etherfish |
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whippoorwill
USA
450 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 09:07:30 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
The areas of expertise that can be mastered are quite simple, and often not worth mentioning, like "I am a master at using a spoon".
Hmmm.... even then.... Can you play the spoons as a rhythm instrument or make a spoon stick to the end of your nose? |
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 9:05:11 PM
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Yes and yes.
I was thinking about this subject, and realized that there are athletes who have mastered certain sports. But that's because sports are man made, so achieving your personal best is mastery. |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 9:28:41 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Etherfish
Yes and yes.
I was thinking about this subject, and realized that there are athletes who have mastered certain sports. But that's because sports are man made, so achieving your personal best is mastery.
Hi Etherfish,
I can tell you from many years as an athlete and coach, I'm yet to meet an athlete, even ones others would look at as having mastery, who didn't think there were things to improve. It's a relative word that really doesn't exist when you look at it closely.
The whole notion of self mastery is a double edged sword. On one hand it leads to a person taking up a path to improve their lives, on the other, it creates a concept of inadequacy with What Is– in the mind. The very pursuit of it, creates the sense of not being it already.
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 10:13:29 PM
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Interesting Anthem; thanks.
I understand the double edged sword, but don't you think the concept of "personal best" can be very empowering?
There is so much talk today about trying to help students avoid the loss of self esteem that could come from failure, that they miss the empowerment that can come from beating your own record.
Of course the teacher would have to convey that there is no inadequacy with what is; only the anticipation of a miraculous future.
It's two ways of looking at the same thing, neurotically or optimistically. |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2012 : 10:46:42 PM
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You are right, the word master was not appropiate, yet I hope the meaning and intention of the post was there. Don't no, but if Yogani writes about his insights of SBP and DM then this motivates me like hell. Sure everyone goes his own way and has to find out and decide what is best for him/her =)
Still, come back to the practice friends!! =P Again and again like to the mantra =) |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2012 : 06:55:28 AM
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Originally posted by Etherfish
quote:
Interesting Anthem; thanks.
I understand the double edged sword, but don't you think the concept of "personal best" can be very empowering?
Yes it certainly can. It was the driving force in my life for decades. The problem that comes with it is the idea of "failure" when such goals aren't met. It's really presence, volume and repetition that leads to higher levels of performance, smoothness and proficiency at any task. The "personal" just gets in the way of the "best" in performing.
quote:
There is so much talk today about trying to help students avoid the loss of self esteem that could come from failure, that they miss the empowerment that can come from beating your own record.
I look more at the word "failure". It is missing the point entirely in my opinion of "learning". People learn when they don't achieve their goals or when things don't work out as intended. Self-esteem can only be "lost" if people buy into the concept that they are somehow less if things don't go their way. Life often has other plans, can we see the value in What Is currently happening for us?
quote:
Of course the teacher would have to convey that there is no inadequacy with what is; only the anticipation of a miraculous future.
It's two ways of looking at the same thing, neurotically or optimistically.
Yes I think this is key, that whatever thoughts someone is having about right now, doesn't change the fact of What Is. Anticipating a future of a certain kind is a recipe for unhappiness in my opinion. I would be inclined to look for the miraculous in the now, not in some future that doesn't exist.
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Etherfish
USA
3615 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2012 : 8:09:20 PM
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Yes, good points. I know what you mean, the personal getting in the way of best. I had self esteem problems growing up, not because of things not going "my way", but not going the way of a parent lording over me. So I finally discovered the technique of failing on purpose so people would leave me alone and shut up and quit watching.
Then as I got older, I just do my best without comparing it to anything. So much easier and more aware.
I was just ranting because I think there is this faulty concept in public schools that they should let everyone fail to avoid bad feelings, and I think it dampens kid's ambition. |
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maheswari
Lebanon
2516 Posts |
Posted - Nov 25 2012 : 06:17:08 AM
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update: even without sitting practices the purification and opening are happening....one has episodes of overload (minor more or less cause i am not doing sitting practices) followed by periods of no overload symptoms at all...
once the process is triggered it just continues to happen....on auto pilot mode
off course keep the grounding to make the process smooth more or less |
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Can no longer meditate or do any practices
