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Anthem
1608 Posts |
 Posted - Jul 30 2008 : 7:28:31 PM
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Feel free to add on, not in perfect order, some observations along the way...
Pre-enlightenment milestones
- Intense desire for the truth (something more).
- Intense interest in removing emotional and mental blocks which cause unhappiness and limitation.
- Intense desire to find something deeper within.
- First contact with what Is.
- Rise of kundalini and inner energy experiences.
- Intense Ecstatic mixed with sexual energy experiences.
- Visual recognition of pure being/ internally and externally.
- Life priorities completely change to nurture inner transformation.
- Increasingly positive attitude.
- More open minded to things initially perceived as negative or undesirable.
- Increase in empathy and compassion for others.
- Better relationships with others and oneself.
- Increasing emotional and mental calmness.
- Gradual refinement of inner energies, there but quiet, smooth, few surges, initial ecstatic/ sexual surges subside.
- Letting go of chasing energy experiences.
- The shift from looking for experiences during sitting practices to enjoying them outside of practices.
- Less identification with thoughts and emotional reactions.
- Systematic breakdown of belief system.
- Expanding and open-ended perception of reality.
- Expansion of love for oneself and others.
- Increasing service to others.
- Increasing daily happiness and feelings of content.
- Perceiving nothingness.
- Knowing oneself as nothingness.
- More time simply being, longer times present in the here and now automatically without thought.
- Slow and gradual deconstruction of the imaginary "I" concept.
- Mind no longer taken seriously, ego recognized and identified with less and less.
- Understanding the creation of the "I" identity and perceiving the constant reinforcement of "I".
- Recognition of the perception of the dual nature of reality and the reality of non-duality superimposed through it.
- The shift to identifying as pure being rather than "I"
- The reduction of desires from many to few (one?).
- Abiding calmness leading to deep physical relaxation and peace.
- Expansion of witnessing (consciously) to sleep states.
- Happiness spanning from meditation to meditation and from meditation to sleep with few interruptions.
- Letting it all go...
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Edited by - Anthem on Jul 31 2008 10:18:48 AM |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2008 : 10:26:17 AM
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| Are you sure you're not enlightened, Andrew? |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2008 : 11:14:20 AM
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Positive! The good news is "I" can never be enlightened and still lot's of work left to be done here! |
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Manipura
USA
870 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2008 : 11:20:47 AM
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| It's an admirable list. As far as I can tell, you haven't left anything out, including humility. :) |
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david_obsidian
USA
2602 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2008 : 11:47:56 AM
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That is a great list.
I would also add 'a strong sense of humor', which is hinted at under 'the mind no longer taken seriously'.
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Richard
United Kingdom
857 Posts |
Posted - Jul 31 2008 : 2:42:14 PM
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He He when you start to see things for what they are what can you take seriously? 
Great list love it |
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maya_1347
USA
19 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2008 : 9:03:23 PM
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Expansion of being - being present in places where physical body is not able to.
Love and Light
Maryam |
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Ananda
3115 Posts |
Posted - Aug 04 2008 : 10:00:11 AM
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sharing willingly the pain of others.
beautiful list, god bless.
namaste,
Ananda |
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brother neil
USA
752 Posts |
Posted - Sep 04 2008 : 10:01:26 PM
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"I" got one you didnt
ability to More
sorry about the ego slip  |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Sep 05 2008 : 02:31:52 AM
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Anthem - love your list!
Meg - I am still laughing over your coment.......it is just perfect!
quote:
Are you sure you're not enlightened, Andrew?
quote:
Positive! The good news is "I" can never be enlightened and still lot's of work left to be done here!
Andrew .....*laughing*.......
.....oh....I am in stitcehs....sorry.....just a sec......
ahem.....
Yes - Andrew. Will you please consider that the one who is positive about his own non-enlightenment....is....*laughing*.......you know....can you just not listen to too much to him? Please? When he doesn't say this.....we are left with the list.....we are left with Anthem.......and this is a list full of light, yes?
Have a splendid day!
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 06 2008 : 9:43:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Katrine
Anthem11 .....*laughing*.......
.....oh....I am in stitcehs....sorry.....just a sec......
ahem.....
Yes - Anthem11. Will you please consider that the one who is positive about his own non-enlightenment....is....*laughing*.......you know....can you just not listen to too much to him? Please? When he doesn't say this.....we are left with the list.....we are left with Anthem.......and this is a list full of light, yes?
Have a splendid day!
Hi Katrine,
Keep spreading the light wherever you go, it's wonderful to feel the shine.
It took me a second to get this post and you are absolutely right, what are we left with without a "me" to be positive about anything? More light, very enjoyable your post made "me" drop away a little bit more and for that there is deep gratitude.
I have had some interesting experiences the last few weeks, I went through a period of about 4 days where the center reference point of "I" completely vanished for a while. Perceiving was wide open, for a lack of a better description, in activity there was doing, but no sense of a doer unless I thought about it and referenced activity to "me" or "I".
Briefly just after the end of these 4 days, a moment of grace was bestowed where there was a profound sense of God, flowing through every molecule of existence including through my being. I felt so deeply connected to everything that is. I know in hindsight that "I" made an effort to latch on to these experiences, thinking more effort was required to perpetuate or deepen such experiences. The sense of "I" reasserted itself and although I knew intellectually that God was everything, I had no real sense of it. It was difficult to feel cut off, even if it was knowingly by my own thoughts, almost like a separation from a loved one.
So a list is produced above, but there is a fluctuation that is experienced here between "I" and just being. I have had brief glimpses over the last few years (all from different angles) of Oneness, but no lasting sense of it. The sense of nothingness watching through eyes is more often my sense of self, with moments of falling back into "I" that can last a minute or sometimes a few days.
So when I say there is lot's of work to be done here, there is clearly a lifetime job (or more) of clearing an infinite array of attachments to beliefs I hold about existence. The more that is seen through, the more I reside as pure being. I hope that the more I reside as pure being, that the sense of oneness in my heart will arise and I will intimately realize the "nothingness" here (in this mind body of mine) is the very same nothingness in all else, that there is one not two and that I will come to know myself in expanded oneness with all that is.
Hopefully this isn't an inflated fantasy that is keeping me disconnected from the very thing my heart yearns for.
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2008 : 11:21:04 AM
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Hi Andrew
quote:
It took me a second to get this post and you are absolutely right, what are we left with without a "me" to be positive about anything? More light, very enjoyable your post made "me" drop away a little bit more and for that there is deep gratitude.
I am grateful too (And the laughter was lovely - thanks for that!)
Your experiences of naturally dropping into the moment are beautiful!
quote:
I know in hindsight that "I" made an effort to latch on to these experiences, thinking more effort was required to perpetuate or deepen such experiences.
Yes - the mind reasserts itself by logically explaining what is and as such experiencially removing itself from it .
quote:
It was difficult to feel cut off, even if it was knowingly by my own thoughts, almost like a separation from a loved one.
Exactly like a separation from a loved one.....
The difficult feeling is grace.....pointing you back to yourself.
quote:
So when I say there is lot's of work to be done here, there is clearly a lifetime job (or more) of clearing an infinite array of attachments to beliefs I hold about existence.
Well.....what is a lifetime really....if not one single instant?
And what difference does it make if your rucksack weighs 10 k or 1 k.....as long as you take it off......yes? It reminds me of the poem I wrote some time back:
Just for a moment
It doesn’t matter how surrendered I think I am
All that matters is that I surrender Now
It doesn’t matter what I did yesterday
All that matters is that I act Now
It doesn’t matter if I didn’t love you yesterday
All that matters is that I am loving Now
One moment of absolute awareness
is undoing a million years of ignorance
Always
One moment is all it takes
I let go of all the moments I forgot to be
In this instant, I forget everything I am supposed to be
This is all it takes
One moment of absolute, limitless openness
This is always the power of Now:
No matter where you come from;
no matter where you are going;
no matter how far or short you have travelled;
your Life, your Love, your Sight and your Joy
lie within your very heart
It is never anywhere else
It is closer to you than a heartbeat
You are never apart from it
Just as the warmth of the sun is implicit,
so can water never be separated from its wetness,
nor you from me
We are always one
If you are frozen – even then, I am just hidden within
Any warmth will melt me into view
Any warmth
So be available!
Let my rays touch your face
If not yesterday – then Now
Any way will do
No matter how heavy your rucksack……
you can always take it off!
Pause for a moment
Please come sit with me
Just for a moment – stay!
Lay your head in my lap
Let us be silent together
Now that two are one;
while you are resting;
just for a moment,
let me caress you awake
quote:
I hope that the more I reside as pure being, that the sense of oneness in my heart will arise and I will intimately realize the "nothingness" here (in this mind body of mine) is the very same nothingness in all else, that there is one not two and that I will come to know myself in expanded oneness with all that is.
You ARE, Andrew. And it is happening through Andrew......not outside of him. As such we are neither one nor two....just the zero that you speak of. It is the direct experience of reality that will substitute the beliefs.....not prolonged effort at removing doubts. This is of course why we practise.
Reality longs for you in exact proportion to the extent you long for it.
Bound to meet and merge.
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Sep 07 2008 : 5:51:23 PM
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| Ahh...very beautiful post and poem. Soothing and appropriate, thank you. |
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 1:03:30 PM
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Lately I have been observing an interesting change in direction on the path towards awakening.
From pretty much the time the inner energies awoke, all my focus was on the ego and dismantling it. There were continuous observations about how it operated, displayed itself and all around infiltrated every aspect of my life. As time went on, I started to realize that it was merely a cohesion of thoughts which gave the ego its illusory appearance. I saw that the concept of "I" somehow got confused and this thought got referenced continuously as my identity. I began to see that it wasn't me but arose in this observer. Over time there was a clarification that the ego was not me and did not exist in the way I believed it had and there was greater acceptance of the mind.
I soon lost interest with the ego as a whole and was more interested in exploring and understanding those individual thoughts and how they seemed to hijack my consciousness from time to time and cause me tremendous suffering when believed in. I loved nothing more than seeing through the "lies" of the mind and learning to see the truth of what Is more clearly. I wanted to understand everything about the mind and my relationship to the universe, was I nothingness, how was there oneness, where did God fit into all of this etc. I read every book I could get my hands on, my mind absorbed it all, Nisargatta, Tolle, Maharshi, Byron Katie, Adyashanti and on and on. Soon there was very little I hadn’t heard before and that my mind hadn’t already "digested". It was all saying the same thing from different angles and this mind became saturated with it. Over time, everything about the non-dual aspect of reality was accepted as matter of fact.
After this saturation point, more interest was then directed to understanding here, where this being emanates, things moved to the heart. The mind understood all the theories of non-duality, knew itself as nothingness, not thoughts, not emotions, not anything but pure being, but the heart still wasn’t satisfied or free from suffering. It has gone full circle in a lot of ways and is now all about the heart and removing and releasing every idea that causes any suffering. Letting go is taking place across the board and has been all encompassing, from letting go of every subtle way “I” tries to control what others think, to letting go of all expectations about everything and anything and accepting nothing less than all that is.
So back in the heart again, but in a more complete way, the mind can only tolerate so much conversation about This, That and already being It etc. it’s all true, but ouch, I’d rather rest in the heart for now and there doesn’t seem to be a lot of room to maneuver in any case so this is all that matters now, the heart simply wants nothing more than to let go of all suffering, interesting to see where things will flow next.
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 1:36:39 PM
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Hi Anthem.....
Have you read "Real Love" by Greg Baer? I was given this book for Christmas this year and if you haven't read it I think (based on your above post) that you would really enjoy and benefit from reading this book. I'm pretty sure you "understand" all the concepts that are presented in the book, but I think that actually reading these concepts all put together in one concise format is very helpful. Let me know if you have a hard time finding it if you decide to go look for it, and I'll send you a copy.
Love,
Carson |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 3:24:04 PM
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Andrew, thank you for sharing this
I recognize all you write....all the coming together inside....
quote:
So back in the heart again, but in a more complete way, the mind can only tolerate so much conversation about This, That and already being It etc
Yes....ouch....we get so fed up, don't we?
And this is not mind - this is Grace
Literally, Andrew.
Mind is not capable of being fed up. Only Grace is Mind is never satiated.
So it is Grace that says: Enough of this. Now the other.
And the other is Love.
Heart flowing from Heart.
Grace
quote:
I’d rather rest in the heart for now
That is such a relief, Andrew
quote:
and there doesn’t seem to be a lot of room to maneuver in
That's beautifully expressed
That's just it......mind cannot enter Heart
The Heart is that which mind rises in. That which is making this rising possible. Not doing it (neither Heart nor mind does anything), just making it possible. Mind is always rising within the Heart. So how can it enter the Heart?
quote:
the heart simply wants nothing more than to let go of all suffering,
Are you sure...have you asked it?
Is it the Heart that holds onto suffering? Is anybody holding on?
Or is even this thought: "the heart wants nothing more than to let go of all suffering" - itself the suffering?
You know.....the only way I can understand that I cannot understand Heart......is to be in love. I hadn't been in love for years (other than the love of Truth).....so when it happens...it is great Because all the cleverness leaves the building *laughing*. It is simply great....to for once not be able to make sense of anything *laughing* It is a tremendous relief. And everything surfaces because of it. It started as being in love....very calm, very simple....no words......then I became attached....quite painful, seemingly very complicated....a lot of words.....and then Grace says "enough of that! now the other"......and this is this :-)
And I am still in love :-) Very calm and very simple. No words....except some poems now and then. And laughter. And nobody is here! Nobody dies of it either  On the contrary :-) All is Life!
Nothing can touch it.
Nothing ruins it.
And it is everywhere I look.
It is Freedom.
It is what I am.
What you are.
Love is love. And thoughts are thoughts. The latter always obscures the former.
When looking calmly (which is always the gentle, but dissolving look of love) at that which I thought was my heart.......it turned out to be only thoughts and emotions (a friend (grace) helped me with this looking). If you can see your heart apart from yourself, then that is not it. Nobody grasps at anything. Only the investment in the belief that I am anything other than Silence that is the Heart....only this is in the way of THIS.
Why do we say it is so difficult to be quiet?
It is not difficult...it is the easiest of all.... to be quiet. It is just like resting in the arms of your lover. That is not difficult, is it?
It is laying all of me in the hands of all moments - every now. Not every second or every third now - every now. Yet - the inner stopping happens when it happens. All I can "do" is contribute by laying myself down. Be quiet. The Heart pulls mind into itself. I cannot go there as mind. I am here. Mind can only drown in Heart.
quote:
interesting to see where things will flow next.
I love the way you flow right here, Andrew.
Am smiling right now, thank you
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 3:47:35 PM
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Hi Carson
We cross posted
I'd love to read that book - let's see.....
Jepp....Amazon had it. Just ordered it.
Thank you |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 4:46:39 PM
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Hi Katrine,
Yes I am forever grateful to my "secret Santa" for this book...it is truly life changing for most people I believe. Life changing for me for sure. Love has been changing my life slowly over the past 6 months or so, (strongly over the last 2 months I'd say) and this book kinda is the climax of it all for me. It shows how we as humans use "Getting and Protecting Behaviors" (running, attacking, lying and acting like a victim) to get "Imitation Love" (praise, power, pleasure and safety) in replacement for what Greg Baer calls "Real Love". (Unconditional Love) And how when we use these "Behaviors" we not only cannot GIVE real love, but we can't recieve it either because we have been soliciting for it and this makes it tainted when recieved for real. So only by giving up our "Getting and Protecting Behaviors" and basically telling the truth about ourselves, our true motivations and our faults can we truly feel unconditionally loved and therfore start unconditionally loving others. The book is truly filled with wonderful revelations and Truth for me. I hope you find it as useful as I have. Can't wait to hear what you think of it.
Love,
Carson
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Edited by - CarsonZi on Dec 29 2008 4:54:51 PM |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 4:58:34 PM
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Carson
If the book is anywhere closely as useful as your post about it, then it explains why I ordered it unquestioned.
I will love it. No question about it.
By the way...I am not familiar with this word "soliciting"....what does it mean, please?
It reminded me of a real estate seller...and a car salesman....??
Thank you, Carson |
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CarsonZi
Canada
3189 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 5:25:45 PM
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Hi Katrine....soliciting in this sense is basically asking for something. When we go through all the measures mentioned above to recieve Love, when we actually DO recieve it, it doesn't mean much because we were asking for it. Had we not been asking for it and had recieved Love anyways it would have meant a lot more. The book has a lot to do with removing expectations on others because you can't be disappointed if you don't expect anything. And realizing that we allow ourselves to react the way we do to things, and this is usually because deep down we are craving unconditional love. Noone can "make" us angry. When we start to see other people's anger as them looking for "Real Love" it is a lot easier not to take things personally and react from a place of unconditional love towards this person. And us showing this unconditional love has an exponential effect because it allows this other person to show the same to another. Etc etc. I've completely oversimplified things here, but you get the jist. Hope you enjoy and am happy I could point you in the direction of it.
Love,
Carson |
Edited by - CarsonZi on Dec 29 2008 5:28:11 PM |
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Dec 29 2008 : 5:34:24 PM
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Thanks a lot, Carson
quote:
I've completely oversimplified things here, but you get the jist.
I love it simple - so this is great.
I'll post back when I've read the book. I won't get it until February
The jist however....is here
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Dec 30 2008 : 12:05:09 AM
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Hi Katrine,
Thanks for dropping by, very appreciated.
quote:
Originally posted by Anthem11
the heart simply wants nothing more than to let go of all suffering,
quote:
Originally posted by Katrine
Are you sure...have you asked it?
Is it the Heart that holds onto suffering? Is anybody holding on?
Funny, this made me laugh. Have I asked it? Well good question, obviously the heart doesn't hold opinions like this, only the mind does. So I guess that is where this idea stops. However, I have noticed my only concern these days seems to be with making my heart happy, I might be getting stuck on this idea for no reason. I feel pulled to operate from the heart, it is here unavoidable, it is being.
Have you noticed the process of finding the peace and content of just being, meaning: living in the here and now, then going through a few clearing issues, getting overly busy in life and then seeking again to get back, once it is realized that something is missing? This seeking leads to ideas and strategies and around we go. It's all an illusion I know, but I seem to find periods of content and peace, they seem to be more frequent and extended where I simply am and know there is nothing to seek and then it gets obscured and I go around again on this wheel. I need to stick "just be in the here and now" on my forehead or something!
quote:
Or is even this thought: "the heart wants nothing more than to let go of all suffering" - itself the suffering?
This could be true, I will look at this, thank you.
quote:
You know.....the only way I can understand that I cannot understand Heart......is to be in love. I hadn't been in love for years (other than the love of Truth).....so when it happens...it is great Because all the cleverness leaves the building *laughing*. It is simply great....to for once not be able to make sense of anything *laughing* It is a tremendous relief.
Funny you should mention it, the last couple of weeks I have been very confused by my heart, not understanding it at all or the coming and going of emotions and then consequently looking more intently for the why's of every feeling. Wanting to solve all the thoughts that were causing any ripples in that peace, maybe just another subtle mental strategy I will have look into, but I know peace and love comes from understanding so it was this desire for understanding of everything that has been driving me.
This reflecting seems to be helping, I may have inadvertently set my mind onto some tasks that aren’t necessary.
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Dec 30 2008 : 11:04:50 AM
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Hi Andrew
Thanks for coming back
quote:
I have noticed my only concern these days seems to be with making my heart happy,
When quiet.....when not going shopping with thoughts, images and emotions....it is very amazing......and incredibly trusting....but the Heart seems to naturally be happy all by itself. So resting as Heart.....is being very happy................ For no reason at all.....That's just it......it is not to fathom! If fathoming is tried....it simply ruins it. Better be still....trusting.....*laughing*.....It is SO not serious !! .....*laughing*......
....ahem....
quote:
I might be getting stuck on this idea for no reason.
No reason...yes that's it. Noone makes Heart happy. So just relax in this. Noone is quiet either........*laughing*.......sorry.....I know it sounds ...impossible.....but it is! To be quiet just reveals it after a little while......like you wrote.....it has happened many times, yes?
quote:
I feel pulled to operate from the heart, it is here unavoidable, it is being.
Yes - this is Grace. The Heart will pull "i" into itself.....it is being. It is just that noone operates from here. It is all just....spontaneously happening. Noone does anything. Noone gets pulled either Just don't interfere and stay quiet while everything happens...thoughts, emotions, images, .....whatever...just let it happen without interfering.
quote:
Have you noticed the process of finding the peace and content of just being, meaning: living in the here and now, then going through a few clearing issues, getting overly busy in life and then seeking again to get back, once it is realized that something is missing?
Many, many, many, many times, Andrew
A few clearing issues???
Are you kidding....more like a thousand..... *laughing*......
But the seeing of the unreality of "i".....the blessing of that.....it changed the viewpoint. Not only now.....It changes the past too. Like you say in the post above:
quote:
Over time there was a clarification that the ego was not me and did not exist in the way I believed it had and there was greater acceptance of the mind.
The "i" is what all the rest is hooked onto. Who is it that accepts the mind? Who is the believer?
Is there anyone.....when quiet.....is there an "i" here?
The thing about acceptance...is simply that it is a relaxation. In acceptance.....it is closer to being quiet, isn't it? If acceptance is here....what is there to talk about...right? So I am quiet instead.
And.....*pling*.....the giggling starts
To be nothing beats everything......*laughing*.....*laughing*......
To be obliterated.......is incredibly funny........*laughing*......
And noone died
Still am
quote:
This seeking leads to ideas and strategies and around we go. It's all an illusion I know, but I seem to find periods of content and peace, they seem to be more frequent and extended where I simply am and know there is nothing to seek and then it gets obscured and I go around again on this wheel
Yes....there is interest in other things than being quiet, see....
Again...noone finds periods of content and peace. Content and peace is what is naturally here when Quiet. Right then.....nothing else was interesting in particular. Maybe you had just satisfied a desire........being relaxed. It doesn't take much to satisfy you if you have meditated for a long time When a desire is met.....we are not hankering after anything, are we... So...in this "coming together" inside........the focus is completely relaxed....nowhere in particular..... no split....and therefore all over the place....which is Here and Now. Which is neither within nor without (or both). This is Stillness. Being Quiet. Yet noone is quiet....
See?
Mind always seems hungry. The temptation to go with it....you know....many things seem more interesting than Silence, right?
All these are allowed and accepted. Every single one of them. Simply because in the acceptance.....the pull inwards happens quicker.
Enjoying is not different from enjoying!
We think we are enjoying objects.......but really......we are quiet for a little while......and it is THIS enjoying itself. Not the object. The Self.
It is just this fantastic amazingness....that Being Quiet....is enjoying for no reason at all.....*laughing*......everything is funny .......*laughing*......and loveable 
Beats me - that's for sure!!!
quote:
Funny you should mention it, the last couple of weeks I have been very confused by my heart, not understanding it at all or the coming and going of emotions and then consequently looking more intently for the why's of every feeling
.
Mind is very good at analyzing, isn't it....it looks with intent......it thinks it is doing the looking. But mind is confusement in the trying to make sense of Heart.
Heart is clear.
It cannot be made sense of, that’s all.
Allow the feelings....don't talk about them...don't even lable them....just let them come and go....nothing is wrong with you, Andrew.
Here is from my movie:
When attached....there was judgement coming up concerning this.......the attachment was labled "weakness"......a "should not have been"........and instantly interest went shopping with this thought......and....wheeeee.....off it spinned.
Until the familiar feeling that you call "something is missing".....which is Grace calling. Nothing is ever missing....(ouch.....sorry......*laughing*)......but it sure seems like it when on a shopping spree, doesn't it?
quote:
Wanting to solve all the thoughts that were causing any ripples in that peace
,
The only thoughts that seem to be ripples are the ones interested in......
quote:
maybe just another subtle mental strategy I will have look into,
No, no......it is enough to not go shopping with this thought. Then it'll just come......and go. Like the next one. Won't be much left for mind to make strategies out of now, will there?
...........*laughing*..................
quote:
but I know peace and love comes from understanding
Gosh, Andrew......for the longest time......this thought was the main motor for "i". But when "i" is undressed as being unreal.....then who is here to understand anything? And if noone is here to understand anything.......then how can understanding be separate from peace and love? As something that should happen prior to it?
Peace and Love is the understanding. And it is completely silent. Not to be grasped. Unfathomable.
It is what I am. Not what I know.
quote:
so it was this desire for understanding of everything that has been driving me.
Yes....I completely sympathize. I am there a million times. When the desire comes.....let it come.....do not move....let it come.....when you are still ....... the looking happens lovingly.....until the desire dissolves. Knowing you, Andrew, it will dissolve pretty quickly
To neither want - nor not want to analyze....is heaven
A splendid New Year to you
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Anthem
1608 Posts |
Posted - Jan 01 2009 : 6:54:33 PM
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I just got back from a couple of days away to this beautiful post of yours Katrine, there is always so much care and wisdom in your words, it was like unwrapping a New Year's Day gift.<- this means grateful to me.
From our last exchange things already started to fall away and over the last couple of days I started to see how I had definitely gone "shopping" as you put it, lol, with quite a few ideas.
I had found quite a few "interesting" ideas recently as well as the frequent urge to resist others. It was a disconcerting feeling to feel so wrapped up in thoughts again, I could hear the voice of ego at volumes and frequency not experienced for a while, it felt like I was regressing (yet another idea). I know now though that it has more to do with expanding than regressing.
I can't fully understand why, even when I know better, that I would take such a trip and so many thoughts would stick, but I do feel more "unmovable" now than I have for a long time. Everything moves around me, but this observing remains still, witness to it all. Life can move so quickly, but that is ok, awareness is untouched.
The idea to make myself happy or that I need to, is seen through thankfully, who knows how long I could have played this game!?!
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Just don't interfere and stay quiet while everything happens...thoughts, emotions, images, .....whatever...just let it happen without interfering.
I needed this reminder, thank you.
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Have you noticed the process of finding the peace and content of just being, meaning: living in the here and now, then going through a few clearing issues, getting overly busy in life and then seeking again to get back, once it is realized that something is missing?
Many, many, many, many times, Anthem11
A few clearing issues???
Are you kidding....more like a thousand..... *laughing*......
It is good to hear that we all go through it, but I wonder if there is an ending point to this, where there is no more leaving? Byron Katie says she hasn't found a reason not to feel happy in 20 years, sounds like she might be one who no longer ever suffers.
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But the seeing of the unreality of "i".....the blessing of that.....it changed the viewpoint. Not only now.....It changes the past too. Like you say in the post above:
I know that there is no "i" but I apparently forget and movement starts again on the inside and I gets wrapped up with "i" and I go along for a trip. Maybe one day I will no longer forget.
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The thing about acceptance...is simply that it is a relaxation. In acceptance.....it is closer to being quiet, isn't it? If acceptance is here....what is there to talk about...right? So I am quiet instead.
Yes, very true!
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Allow the feelings....don't talk about them...don't even lable them....just let them come and go....nothing is wrong with you, Anthem11.
Crap I somehow forgot parts of this! I better go get a better memory!
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No, no......it is enough to not go shopping with this thought. Then it'll just come......and go. Like the next one. Won't be much left for mind to make strategies out of now, will there?
Funny, good thing you're patient, starting to get it again. Mee sloe sumtymze...
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but I know peace and love comes from understanding
Gosh, Anthem11......for the longest time......this thought was the main motor for "i". But when "i" is undressed as being unreal.....then who is here to understand anything? And if noone is here to understand anything.......then how can understanding be separate from peace and love? As something that should happen prior to it?
Peace and Love is the understanding. And it is completely silent. Not to be grasped. Unfathomable.
It is what I am. Not what I know.
I had to put my diving cap on for a moment to get to the bottom of this one. I got tripped up on this idea, it is accurate but I was confused that I had to understand it all prior, an impossible task, like you say it happens simultaneously, a very subtle but important distinction.
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so it was this desire for understanding of everything that has been driving me.
Yes....I completely sympathize. I am there a million times. When the desire comes.....let it come.....do not move....let it come.....when you are still ....... the looking happens lovingly.....until the desire dissolves.
Quite an amazing coincidence, just before getting home, I was at the grocery store and I looked over at someone and in an instant there was love, compassion and understanding all happening simultaneously for their circumstance. I had never been so intensely aware of this process before, like a spotlight was shining on the moment, then I get home to read these words... a wonderful synchronicity… as within, so without, a privilege to experience.
Thank you Katrine for clearing up my clouds, a ray of sunshine my heart is so grateful for.
Love,
A
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Katrine
Norway
1813 Posts |
Posted - Jan 02 2009 : 3:02:23 PM
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Beautiful, Andrew
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I could hear the voice of ego at volumes and frequency not experienced for a while, it felt like I was regressing (yet another idea). I know now though that it has more to do with expanding than regressing.
Yes!
It is so easy to judge periods of "disturbances" like that. I am there too a million times......Just remember that if you can hear "the voice of ego at volumes and frequency not experienced for a while" - then that is not you. There was hearing of it - that's all. Better loud than in a closet somewhere. Whatever needed to surface surfaced, and has now left the premises.
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It is good to hear that we all go through it, but I wonder if there is an ending point to this, where there is no more leaving? Byron Katie says she hasn't found a reason not to feel happy in 20 years, sounds like she might be one who no longer ever suffers.
Well - it sure makes a difference to see that not only are you not the images, thoughts, emotions, but neither are you "that one" (which is noone :-) that leaves. Neither are you "the one" who asks "is there an ending point to this?" You are not even the one who asks the famous question "who am I ?" Even this question is "spotlighted away" before it verbalizes. The effect is the same: Noone is left. And yet you are very obviously here
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I can't fully understand why, even when I know better, that I would take such a trip and so many thoughts would stick
In my case it happens whenever I think I know better
Noone takes such a trip. So....when it happens.....it happens. That's all. I certainly cannot fathom it.
Looking at the bright side of it, though - halleluja - it is great to come home! Isn't it ?
May you always enjoy being a spotlight shining as the moment
Love to you too
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Pre-enlightenment milestones
