|
|
 |
|
| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
 Posted - Jul 11 2016 : 06:00:50 AM
|
It seems that the "internal wiring" or "internal bio-energy circuit factory" of woman have a huge advantage versus those of men if going after meditation via left hand path or sacred sex.
Unless i'm wrong, from what I understand and observed, women have 3 samsaric gates or openings which are physically visible (clitoris, vagina and anus) probably wired as akashic or internal esoterik circuits but not sure how does this connect to Pingali, Ida and Sushumna.
With men, it is bit more complex because the physical penis links at the same time probably two gates mirroring of clitoris and vagina, of course sharing the separate gate of the anus except prostate gland not found in women.
What i'm wondering, is it because women have physical 3 separate gates which could can be precisely charged or aroused that it is always very easy for women to pull up the energy whereas man face conflict of e-jaculation versus in-jaculation in need for specific practice go after pulling up energy experience ?
Sometimes I wonder but maybe I'm wrong, the Clitoris would correspond to Pingali, the Anus to Ida and Vagina to Sushumna so this could explain special secret of massaging at same time these 3 parts of women, incredible energy could rise, eventually kundalini initiation of done properly because this type of sex could be very dangerous.
If this model or description is correct, so the disadvantage for men would lie in conflict to be resolved between Pingali and Sushumna. Of course those men able to transcend homosexuality would accept anal massage as skilled full means or charge the effect which has nothing to do with homosexuality. It would help like a ritual or point focus to accelerate the presence of our hidden female or Yin part because accepting to receive (being penetrated through anus) instead of giving (penetrating with penis).
Unless these sexual parts are just different wiring in charge of reflexology to trigger or access the Muladhara chakra.
One thing which I wonder is that even if women seems to have a pre-wiring prone to quicker path to enlightenment, this might not be so easy either because take the case of nymphomaniac women or some amateur pornographic material (not forced) showing women with the 3 gates highly aroused but not happy after their orgasm.
My understanding of tantra is that at some point, one goes above the illusion of man or women, of sun or moon to recover experience of both dualities then merge of fuse them to really start the deep meditation. So in this plane of existence, what do you advise for man to resolve or re-wire these circuits if one wants to use tantrik energy or sacred sex to help meditation.
Now maybe all this model is wrong so I'm interested to hear any information. |
|
|
sunyata
USA
1505 Posts |
Posted - Jul 11 2016 : 08:09:14 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by selfonlypath
My understanding of tantra is that at some point, one goes above the illusion of man or women, of sun or moon to recover experience of both dualities then merge of fuse them to really start the deep meditation. So in this plane of existence, what do you advise for man to resolve or re-wire these circuits if one wants to use tantrik energy or sacred sex to help meditation.
Hi selfonlypath,
As you are aware, we practice Deep Meditation, Spinal Breathing, Samyama and so on for our spiritual evolution. So we engage in these practices and let the aspects of tantra develop on it's own. Or if you want to actively engage in Tantric practices-Here is the link to tantra lessons.
http://www.aypsite.org/TantraDirectory.html
If we are doing our sitting practices and incorporating Tantra then yes it's a spiritual practice. But if we are just trying to find ways to have peak experiences in sex without sitting practices, then it's sex. That's all it is. People mistake Tantra with wanting to have good sex. There is nothing wrong with this desire , but let's not guise this as spirituality. This has given Tantra a bad rep.
When I came into AYP, I did not read any lessons in Tantra because I had a preconceived idea of what Tantra was. With continued practices, the biology started to change and I started digging in the Tantra Lessons.
The advice would be to start with sitting practices and add the tantra lessons(techniques) as you are inclined to. Self pacing when needed. Devote your bhakti to sitting practices and watch how it flowers all the other aspects of your Life
Also sexual energy or kundalini is stimulated by Spinal breathing, Mudras, Bandhas, Siddhasana, Asanas
The lesson below gives us a snapshot of what Tantra is about.
Lesson T27-The quest for infinite intimacy
quote:
True union is beyond thinking, feeling, clairvoyance, etc. It is beyond the idea of "the other."
It is a paradox. The best way to find true union with another person is by finding union in ourselves. Then there is no personal agenda to get in the way. It is just Self in one serving Self in the other. Infinite intimacy is 100% service to the other, without expectation of receiving anything in return. Infinite intimacy isn't something that can be obtained or hurdled into. It is known by letting go, by surrendering, by giving everything. But more than that - it requires a transformation in the functioning of our nervous system at the most fundamental level. This can be accomplished through yoga.
Your desire for union is good. The frustration comes from pointing it outward to obtain something instead of letting go inward. Even looking into another's eyes is outward, unless we are looking from the perspective of inner silent pure bliss consciousness cultivated in meditation. If you use your desire as bhakti for motivation to do spiritual practices, then you will find what you are seeking, both in yourself and in your lover.
The only true infinite intimacy to be found is in our enlightenment. It is an internal affair in each of us -- the divine union of our inner polarities. That is how we come to it. Then when we make love, we become the loving, and there is no question about someplace to get to, or hurdle to jump. It all melts away, as we become the caressing. Through practices we become it.
In yoga we don't surmount or overcome our obstacles. We dissolve them so the inherent inner light can shine through. This is the secret. Everything is changed by that one simple principle, and the practices that stimulate the reality of it in our nervous system.
It is suggested that you redirect your desire toward wanting to unfold your inner truth. Then things will happen. You must be willing to act -- willing to engage in daily practices. With daily practices, your experience of life will expand in indescribable ways, and so will your lovemaking.
The guru is in you.
|
Edited by - sunyata on Jul 11 2016 08:39:32 AM |
 |
|
|
Dogboy
USA
2193 Posts |
Posted - Jul 11 2016 : 1:17:43 PM
|
quote:
My understanding of tantra is that at some point, one goes above the illusion of man or women, of sun or moon to recover experience of both dualities then merge of fuse them to really start the deep meditation.
As Sunyata outlines, for tantra to be effective, inner silence gained through DM is really the first step. SBP and mudras encourage prana to rise up from the root, and once this is established tanta practices can be used to nudge your neurobiology to draw energy up naturally and automatically. I am living proof, amazed that sexual arousal can be channeled and harnessed in this way. Horniness is no longer caged in my loins, it ungulates through my system and has opened my heart. |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Jul 11 2016 : 1:44:07 PM
|
Hello Sunyata and Dogboy,
It seems both of you just took a very small paragraph of my initial questions completely suppressing the core topic in subject Esoterik nadis of female and male I was hoping to discuss in this thread.
I'm fully aware there is right hand path (white tantra) and left hand tantra path (red tantra). However most of the topic I was hoping to have answers concerns the left hand path including the anatomic and psychic channels differences between a woman and man.
Maybe some other members could comment so I'll rewrite more precisely my initial post to secure the topic...
It seems that the "internal wiring" or "internal bio-energy circuit factory" of woman have a huge advantage versus those of men if going after meditation via left hand path or sacred sex.
Unless i'm wrong, from what I understand and observed, women have 3 samsaric gates or openings which are physically visible (clitoris, vagina and anus) probably wired as akashic or internal esoterik circuits but not sure how does this connect to Pingali, Ida and Sushumna.
With men, it is bit more complex because the physical penis links at the same time probably two gates mirroring of clitoris and vagina, of course sharing the separate gate of the anus except prostate gland not found in women.
What i'm wondering, is it because women have physical 3 separate gates which could can be precisely charged or aroused that it is always very easy for women to pull up the energy whereas man face conflict of e-jaculation versus in-jaculation in need for specific practice go after pulling up energy experience ?
Sometimes I wonder but maybe I'm wrong, the Clitoris would correspond to Pingali, the Anus to Ida and Vagina to Sushumna so this could explain special secret of massaging at same time these 3 parts of women, incredible energy could rise, eventually kundalini initiation of done properly because this type of sex could be very dangerous.
If this model or description is correct, so the disadvantage for men would lie in conflict to be resolved between Pingali and Sushumna. Of course those men able to transcend homosexuality would accept anal massage as skilled full means or charge the effect which has nothing to do with homosexuality. It would help like a ritual or point focus to accelerate the presence of our hidden female or Yin part because accepting to receive (being penetrated through anus) instead of giving (penetrating with penis).
Unless these sexual parts are just different wiring in charge of reflexology to trigger or access the Muladhara chakra.
Now maybe all this model is wrong so I'm interested to hear any information. |
Edited by - selfonlypath on Jul 11 2016 1:54:54 PM |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Jul 15 2016 : 03:32:22 AM
|
Long ago, I've read book written by Lama Yeshe "The Bliss of Inner Fire" where page 108 and 149 offers some perspective but via tibetan tantra.
Page 149: the semen that comes from the male sex organ during ordinary orgasm does not come from the central channel. For both males and females, the energy and bliss of ordinary sexual experience does not come from the central channel… The bliss of ordinary orgasm is produced by the kundalini touching the outside of the central channel. In the logic of tantra yoga, if the kundalini energy generates such bliss when it touches the oustide of the central channel, there is no question that it will generate incredible bliss when it flows the central channel.
Page 108: There is also the secret, or sex, chakra. This is red, has thirty-two branches, and is level with base of the spine. In a man, this is located at the base of the sex organ. As well, there is the middle secret chakra, also known as the jewel chakra, which is white and has eight branch channels; and there is the tip secret chakra, which is at the end of the penis, where the central channel ends. A question might arise: the secret chakras of the male body are explained very clearly, but what about the female chakras ? A woman also has three secret chakras: the secret, the middle secret, and tip secret. For a woman, however, these three are hidden inside her body. The tip secret chakra, where her central channel ends, is at the end of the cervix where it opens into the vagina. The man's organ is outside, but the woman's is held inside. As this shows, there is a mutual arrangement between male's vajra and the female's lotus. Completion stage tantra also explains that a yogini has a subtle channel that extends from the end of her central channel, and that when male and female organs join, this subtle channel enters the central channel of the yogi, giving rise to incredible bliss
N.B. In tibetan tantra, the central channel is sushumna, the left channel is Ida and the right channel is Pingali. As for the channel, it means nadi and branches means lotus.
Unfortunately, it is not easy to find more information about the 3 gates which motivated my thread, in particular the anus and the clitoris. If we look on human anatomy, most physical parts or biology are the same wether woman or men except really the sexual, the prostate and maybe special gland in women since no prostate. |
Edited by - selfonlypath on Jul 15 2016 04:07:05 AM |
|
|
|
Dogboy
USA
2193 Posts |
Posted - Jul 15 2016 : 06:54:10 AM
|
Greetings selfonly
This is interesting reading and, as a man, I can say I have had distinct sensations at various times at the three chakras you mentioned, as well as a "drawing up" of the anal sphincter during rest after Samyama. As an AYP practitioner with no prior meditation knowledge, I follow Yogani's prescription not to "delve under the hood" or try to manipulate chakras or get too involved in rewiring anything, that the practice alone will handle what needs to occur in my particular neurobiology. Frankly, this is a relief for me in that I don't need to know the specifics of my neurobiology or involve myself in tinkering with it.
Perhaps more experienced yogis will weigh in and engage you in the discussion you seek. Have you tried posing this discussion on other spiritual forums? I'm assuming you too are an AYP practitioner, and am curious why you want to engage in tantra tinkering of your neurobiology when you may not necessarily need to. |
|
|
|
BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Jul 15 2016 : 06:59:23 AM
|
Hi selfonlypath
I'm afraid you may find us AYPers unequal to a discussion about the internal wiring. As you probably know, in AYP, chakras and nadis are considered to be 'under the hood' i.e. we don't pay very much attention to the theoretical side of it, but let it unfold in practice as it will.
quote:
Originally posted by selfonlypath
it is always very easy for women to pull up the energy
I find that the pulling up the energy is less of a challenge than integrating it once you have pulled it up. It is the latter that takes years of patient practice both for men and women.
All the best on your path
PS Dogboy, just crossposted  |
Edited by - BlueRaincoat on Jul 15 2016 07:00:33 AM |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Jul 15 2016 : 09:53:24 AM
|
Hi BlueRaincoat,
I've been a member of this forum for many years, did try some AYP techniques then decided to not pursue. My background comes more from ritual based, shamanic and going beyond shaman huge ego-traps only manageable by tantra then advaita from what i've seen.
Understanding what is under the hood is indeed to be avoided because you'd know in advance what to deconstruct so would never deconstruct or surrender, one step forward and two steps backward. However my question was more focused on the visible hood, for example a clitoris, a vagina, a penis, an anus… these are really here in this plane of existence as when kechari cut is done in one's mouth.
The way I see things, the 2 key questions one ask concerns (1) where do I come from and (2) where do I go when die, no experiental answer to these will create stress and suffering. Some special culture rituals, initiations will look to induce near death and stay conscious to discover death is an illusion. Some other rites will use sex to re-connect the moment or the gate when say our parents made love then expand consciousness. Both moments or quests are really hard, very existential but the tantrik sex seems bit more safe and natural even though full of fatal traps. Of course, there are many other ways, yogas or system much smoother so it depends on once free will to decide.
What I'm really wondering concerns the hood of woman versus the hood of man, there are some biological differences which necessarily under the hood might imply other effects or lead to same destination wether we invoke chakra, nadi, energy flows.
Of course i'm fully aware my question might be outside of AYP even though there has been some unusual provoking threads in this sub-forum which helped me lot personally. Maybe one suggestion would be to have a special sub-forum for "tantra under AYP" and another one for "tantra not-AYP". I've noticed through the years such difference was introduced regarding Kundalini, namely sub-forum called "Kundalini - AYP Practice-Related" and another sub-forum "Kundalini Issues Not Related to the AYP System" then special sub-forum called "Other Systems and Alternate Approaches" which is really enjoyable.
One thing if you agree, i'd be interested that you share exactly the "pulling up of energy" experience and what do you think are the major karmic blockage or physical blockage in men usually not able to pull up.
Another question I have if you don't mind, is there possibility of another experience of "pulling down the energy" ?
|
|
|
|
FakeYogi
India
100 Posts |
Posted - Jul 16 2016 : 03:09:54 AM
|
| As a pathetic suffer from both nocturnal emotions and premature ejaculations, I have always held the same view as you - enlightenment is far easier for women. Please be encouraged to continue your discussion. |
|
|
|
BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Jul 18 2016 : 1:38:12 PM
|
Hi selfonlypath
Well, I wouldn't know about specific blockages in men, at least not from personal experience.
I would caution about undertaking comparisons between men and women lightly. The thing is, we have a fair amount of knowledge shared by yogis over time and extremely little shared by yoginis. I would not conclude it is easier for women - not at all. The one thing that often seems to be missed is that women - even though they lose very little or no prana during sex - may lose massive amounts of energy over their monthly cycle, with no more control over it than men have over nocturnal emissions. So you guys don't think you have it tougher than us girls.
|
|
|
|
Dogboy
USA
2193 Posts |
Posted - Jul 18 2016 : 11:05:32 PM
|
I never did  |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Aug 28 2016 : 08:47:11 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRaincoat
I would caution about undertaking comparisons between men and women lightly. The thing is, we have a fair amount of knowledge shared by yogis over time and extremely little shared by yoginis. I would not conclude it is easier for women - not at all. The one thing that often seems to be missed is that women - even though they lose very little or no prana during sex - may lose massive amounts of energy over their monthly cycle, with no more control over it than men have over nocturnal emissions. So you guys don't think you have it tougher than us girls.
It would be indeed great to have more knowledge shared by yoginis. Whatever we think on non-dual way or not looking under the hood to not disturb the meditation practice, in this plane of existence there are slight physically differences between woman and man anatomy wether physical or nadis wether we like or not. Since our human vessel is used to progressively go after enlightenment, it would be an asset to know bit more the small difference on esoterik and physical *hardware* to match the meditation practice in more direct way.
As for the menopause versus menstrual cycle, long ago I did start a thread here http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....OPIC_ID=4244 but not too many opinions unfortunately.
|
|
|
|
sunyata
USA
1505 Posts |
Posted - Aug 28 2016 : 09:33:39 AM
|
Hi selfonlypath,
Have you tried other tantra forums? You may be able to find more/detailed
information that you are looking for. |
Edited by - sunyata on Aug 28 2016 09:34:49 AM |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Jan 01 2017 : 02:58:44 AM
|
I've stumbled into this old post of yogani http://www.aypsite.org/forum/topic....C_ID=354#166 which mentions something I've been wondering for long time, namely the role of the bladder in the piping or plumbing.
One extract of the above post quote:
Originally posted by yogani
By the way, the process in women as far as I can tell (even more subjectively) has more similarities than differences to the male spiritual biology, including the absorption of sexual essences up through the urethra into the bladder!
Maybe I'm wrong but I feel intuitively that except some local genitals difference between woman and man bringing duality, the rest of body acting as a vehicle for esoteric or mystic energies is found to be non-dual. There is no difference with head, eyes, legs, arms, heart, kidney including anus… no difference equals non-duality hence the proper vehicle to raise or circulate the tantric effects.
Which leaves difference or duality generator found only say in penis, vagina, clitoris, testicles, prostate, maybe some specific glands of G-spot. So these differences are just polarized, duality-coded and used as gate which needs to be transcended.
Now what really strikes me with yogani explanation of the bladder which can considered non-duality organ with hidden esoterik piping, what ever energy are raised from women essence or man essence should flow through the bladder.
For many years, i've been wondering why when many times I practice the valley method, sometimes I'll need to urinate or feel some pain. Maybe it is blockage I need to dissolve, sometimes I do get partial non-ejaculatory orgasm but never experienced a full non-ejaculatory orgasm. What I usually do with my wife, go to the rest-rooms and urinate which will be lot of fully transparent liquid the resume tantric lovemaking attempt.
One thing I was told in the past, when someone fears something, sometimes it will in no time increase the need to urinate so I assume that maybe raising the sexual energy through a tantric perspective could challenge at some point the physical and neurobiology of the bladder.
Happy New Year, Albert |
|
|
|
selfonlypath
France
297 Posts |
Posted - Mar 05 2017 : 11:13:39 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by BlueRaincoat
The one thing that often seems to be missed is that women - even though they lose very little or no prana during sex - may lose massive amounts of energy over their monthly cycle, with no more control over it than men have over nocturnal emissions. So you guys don't think you have it tougher than us girls.
I've never thought of this aspect of woman "menstruation" and just found this video made in 2011 talking of both effects, namely semen loss and menstrual losse https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6sEUg5rsc4 |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
| AYP Public Forum |
© Contributing Authors (opinions and advice belong to the respective authors) |
|
|
|
|
Esoterik nadis of female and male
