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Jayleno214
USA
87 Posts |
 Posted - Jan 20 2015 : 10:53:26 PM
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When I pay attention to the mantra my breathing stops my spine is filled with ecstasy/prana/bliss (it feels good, i have to unfocusand breathe to avoid orgasm good) going from top to bottom of spine according to the internal verbalization of the mantra just like you an I said it would. When I do not devote my attention I notice the same DM experience I've had for the past four years: thought of what I've done, going to do, body awareness etc.
Is this proper DM? I want what is intended with these lessons. I ask because although it is very pleasurable I know there are more important things. Should I not pay so much attention to do proper DM? Or is near-orgasm DM just right? |
Edited by - Jayleno214 on Jan 21 2015 05:45:58 AM |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Jan 21 2015 : 10:42:23 AM
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Hi Jayleno214
I don't understand the bit about "going from top to bottom of spine according to the internal verbalization of the mantra". It might just be me, or it might be worth clarifying what you are trying to say, so more people will be able to understand and give you their views.
At first sight, I'd say this going "from top to bottom of spine" is not part of the DM instructions. If it happens automatically, then you should allow it, without favouring it. Your attention should favour the mantra |
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compassion
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 02:28:07 AM
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Hi Jayleno,
In deep meditation, we focus our attention on the mantra. If we notice that our breathing stops, we gently return attention from the breath to the mantra. If ecstasy or bliss arises, it is neither good nor bad, we just gently return attention to the mantra.
It sounds like things are happening; however the bliss and ecstasy are included in the 'scenary' that is described by Yogani in the lessons. It can be nice to look at, and can motivate us to sit regularly, but it doesn't get us to our destination any faster (or slower). That is the role of daily practice with focused attention on the mantra. |
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Morning
United Kingdom
10 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 06:14:38 AM
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| I agree that feelings of ecstasy or bliss are great motivators to sit regularly. I think, without that, I would have lost interest in meditation pretty quickly. From that point of view then, if your objective is to sit regularly and those feelings motivate you to do so, wouldn't they be "good"? |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 10:02:10 AM
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Hi Jayleno,
Besides all of the great advise from above I would just like to add. If you really feel the need to direct the mantra may I suggest you focus it on the heart.
Yogani also talks about Solar Centering which is saying the mantra in the heart. It can be a very powerful addition to ones practice so please take care if you go that route.
Take care,
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Edited by - jonesboy on Jan 22 2015 10:03:03 AM |
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Jayleno214
USA
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 11:24:58 AM
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the experience is gone now and I am unable to experience the same again. I can feel the obstructions in my body as tenseness when I favor the mantra now.
my questuon is whether I could have had less obstructions present today if I had not favored the mantra as devotionally the days begote?
and there's a lesson that says the mantra resonates with the spine. I for the head a for the back and m for the bottom. |
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compassion
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 2:28:27 PM
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Hi Morning,
If sitting regularly is 'good', then is not-sitting 'bad'? Who are we to judge that? Likewise, if bliss is good, then is not-bliss bad? Such distinctions are not necessary, and can lead us in the direction of judging some sittings as good and some as not. But all practices take us in the same direction, even the ones where not much appears to be happening. |
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compassion
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 2:43:39 PM
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Hi Jayleno,
It is normal for experiences to come and go. Letting go of previous experiences gives space for more to come.
Probably there is less obstruction from favouring the mantra. Or did I misunderstand what you were asking? |
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Dogboy
USA
2201 Posts |
Posted - Jan 22 2015 : 4:54:34 PM
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quote:
But all practices take us in the same direction, even the ones where not much appears to be happening.
This quote by Compassion is spot on. Often a sit will change mid-stream; surely something internal was discovered and maybe addressed. These moments certainly keep me interested! |
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Morning
United Kingdom
10 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 03:18:54 AM
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Hmmmm.
I appear to have this physical existence, with a nervous system that encourages me to seek out certain experiences (which we label "pleasant") and avoid others (which we label "unpleasant")
Surely I haven't acquired this nervous system just so that I can learn not to be influenced by it? Seems a rather inefficient dog-leg. |
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compassion
87 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 07:37:38 AM
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Hi Morning,
Acting to receive pleasure is certainly one way of living, and we can easily find ourselves doing this, whether it is eating, sleeping, having sex, etc. As far as practices are concerned, we can sit for practices, but beyond that the rest is outside of our control.
It is counterintuitive because it is not how we are used to living. And it can be an ongoing struggle, as we learn that the biggest pleasures require a surrender and non-doing on our part, that as many will confirm is not as easy as just deciding to surrender.
But if you are seeking pleasure, then it doesn't mean you are doing it wrong. The bliss itself is a more powerful teacher than any words in a forum. |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 09:07:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Morning
with a nervous system that encourages me to seek out certain experiences (which we label "pleasant") and avoid others (which we label "unpleasant")
There is a trap there Morning. In seeking and avoiding certain experiences, you put the mind into a striving, goal oriented mode (it's been called the 'doing' or the 'driven' mode and it inevitably leads to looking for more/better and getting dissatisfied with what there is). By contrast, in letting go, and allowing any experience that comes your way (the 'being' mode - the 'nothing to do', 'nowhere to go' mode) you will be able to experience true happiness.
Try to grasp it and you will lose it. Let go and wait for it to find you - that is the clever way to get happiness/pleasant experiences. Counterintuitive, just as Compassion says.
To meditate is to practice your letting go skills - whatever thoughts/feelings/sensations surface, you let go of them and gently return to the mantra, yes? If you aim for pleasurable sensation instead, then you are not practising letting go any more. |
Edited by - BlueRaincoat on Jan 23 2015 11:03:38 AM |
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Morning
United Kingdom
10 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 11:40:44 AM
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I do understand what you're saying (I think - and I've found it to be true from my own experience) - I just always wonder, when our bodies seem to be designed to do a certain thing... Why are they designed that way, if they aren't meant to be used that way?
It's like.... I could be blissfully happy, if I just spent all day meditating. And sometimes the temptation is to do just that. But I keep coming back to this thought that I have a physical body. Surely that isn't an accident, or "test". So... I should use my physical body to do physical things, it would seem. And your body gives you signals (pleasure, pain, sickened, health) to tell you whether or not you are treating it correctly.
But maybe I'm heading into this "Maya" territory, which I've never been able to understand... |
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BlueRaincoat
United Kingdom
1730 Posts |
Posted - Jan 23 2015 : 12:16:33 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Morning
And your body gives you signals (pleasure, pain, sickened, health) to tell you whether or not you are treating it correctly.
Well, the signals are there all right, but reading them doesn’t seem to be entirely straightforward. Some people eat themselves obese, some abuse substances, some get into codependency in their relationships etc. There seems to he a good/healthy way to satisfy our needs as well as a bad/unhealthy way – a pleasure trap.
Why are we designed that way? I don't really know. As I'm contemplating the question I realise I have little motivation to try to answer it. I guess I just don't ask these questions any more. It is just how the world is.  |
Edited by - BlueRaincoat on Jan 23 2015 12:17:38 PM |
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ecstatic SB & ecstatic DM= good or bad
