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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 15 2014 : 10:48:31 AM
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Ok, so lately I've been feeling like a lot of my relationships with family and friends have been a little out of whack and I'm not sure why. All the while I continue to strengthen my relationship with God, so it is a little disorienting at times. I think my inner guru is telling me to take some time away from this place and all the people I'm so familiar with in order to truly understand who I am as a person and what's necessary for me. Part of me feels that in order to truly make progress, I need to remove myself from this environment that I've come to be attached to in subtle ways. But then, another part of me thinks; relationships are our greatest teachers, so maybe working through them is a necessary step in order to understand parts of myself that I would not see otherwise. So I'm conflicted wondering if getting away is actually good for me and not just my mind trying to create drama, or if working through these relationships is a necessary step at this point along the path.
The thing is, I am very aware of the negative behavioral patterns that I observe in family and friends, and this is not just including my interactions with them but also with others I can observe these same patterns manifesting, so I know it's not all having to do with me. The thing is, when you're around these behavioral patterns every single day, you tend to unconsciously engage them in the spur of the moment. And it can be quite a challenge to rise above it until looked at in hindsight. So I find myself feeling thrown off balance a lot, finding myself caught up in these patterns, wanting to try to break the cycle but making more of a mess sometimes. And of course I have plenty negative behavioral patterns of my own, but I guess what I'm trying to say is, you can't fight fire with fire.
Particularly with my family at home something interesting has happened. Nobody is a stranger to my spiritual fervor, my meditation and yoga, etc. But what has this done? Rather than trying to understand why this is so important to me, and how it could even help them... They often subject me to their jokes. Mom, brothers, sisters. I try to laugh off their ignorance, but when my beliefs and practices are joked about and berated constantly, naturally I get defensive at times. Calling it guru crap, Indian trance, zenning out etc etc. "Chaz go back to your Indian trance." "How about you stop zenning out and go get a job." "Chaz I'm not interested in your guru crap right now."
Now here's the funny thing. Apparently because I'm into yoga and meditation... I'm expected to be a saint by now! Always nice and happy. So you know what they do? They deliberately try to get an emotional rise out of me. Now they feel entitled to test my patience.
Here's an example from just yesterday: I'm meditating and my mom needs the mailbox key which is in my possession.
Mom: *opens my door* Oh lord... Zenning out are we? Give me the mailbox key.
Me: *still meditating* it's over there
Mom: so are you just gonna zen out all day?
Me: *silent*
Mom: *taking mailbox key off my keychain and talking loudly to her boyfriend* I'm so tired of Ciara taking all my stuff and not giving it back, that's so annoying. Then you got this one and all he wants to do is zen out all day and not get a job"
Then she slams my door shut... 
I've grown to accept things like this in my home environment. No one in my family really understands that this period in my life is stressful to begin with, simply drifting along trying to find a clear direction. But what I'm doing now is illuminating a path before me, and they don't get that.
The family dynamics over here can be particularly dramatic, stressful, and often reflect a lot of immaturity, specifically emotionally. It's difficult for me to overcome my own emotional immaturity and negative behaviors when I'm literally surrounded by so much of it.
I find even with my friends, we get caught in patterns, and they are not particularly healthy. I've tried to use being more aware of these patterns within myself and others to my advantage, and while I do my best to consciously unravel these patterns, it can be hard when someone else is deeply rooted in them. And you know what? For some odd reason, some people just refuse to let them go, and I find those are the hardest people the deal with...
So where I'm at now, I have a deep urge to find the company of like-minded people working towards the same goals, towards a higher ideal. It's a big reason why I've been around these forums so much, but sadly this is not enough for me... I wish it was enough, but I need the physical presence of people like so many of you here in my life, who just get it and can understand the things that I'm going through in daily life on this path. I feel very alienated right now, I'm surrounded by so many people who seem blind to the glory and love of God, and when I try to express the joy I get from That, it is not always met with enthusiasm. My inner voice says seek out spiritual company. It's necessary for you right now. You need to be surrounded by more conscious people in order to become more conscious yourself. So is this really what I need? Or am I running away from my greatest teachers? I know nobody can answer this question but myself, but hopefully some of you can help me inquire more deeply into this. I would really appreciate it. Thanks!
Much Love,
Chaz |
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kami
USA
920 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2014 : 11:52:39 AM
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Dear Chaz,
 ((((HUG))))
Want to begin by saying how much I loved reading this. The sincerity, longing and beauty is so plain to see. Nothing is as endearing as the perfect combination of honesty and humility. Thank you for sharing.
When I took up meditation, it was similar to your description - there was an expectation that I would suddenly be a saint. I have lost track of the number of times my husband said something like "you do all this yoga and meditation stuff, shouldn't you be behaving differently?" It was hard not to punch him.  I'd retort back or ignore him and go about my business.. Recently, after I grumbled about something, he said something like, "gosh that is just not like you. You are normally happy and even." Just made me laugh hard, for he of course can no longer remember how it "used to be". This "happy and even" sort of snuck up on us both. In fact, he now "wants what I have" and is learning to meditate. Who knew!
It helps, if possible, to go on retreats. It also helps to be on your own for a set time each day; solitude is very, very helpful in inquiry and for strengthening conviction. Is that an option for you? Also, have you tried talking to your family in somber tones on how important this is for you? It may or may not make a difference. People who are caught up in being characters in the dream cannot see it any other way.
It is also helpful to learn to look at your own reaction to everything that happens within and without. You know, one eye turned out and the other turned in. Practice simultaneously watching both, with curiosity. It is quite fascinating to see our own responses and reactions to people and situations. Uncanny to see how quickly the reaction arises and really out of nowhere. As you become adept at that, begin to go deeper to see "where" the reaction came from. Astonishingly, it will be from absolutely nothing that someone else says or does, but how you perceive yourself, or want to be seen by others and yourself. Once you see the real issue, people's "stuff" will stop bothering you. Keep the focus on yourself. I'm finding that is the key to true freedom. Besides, it's totally fun to unravel the mystery of one's own being.
Hope this makes some sense..
Much love.  |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Feb 15 2014 : 12:33:33 PM
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Here's an interesting progression to think about:
1) Dependence 2) Indepedence 3) Enlightenment
(I found that on the Biology of Kundalini website).
When I moved back from San Francisco, broke and divorced, I stayed with my mom until I got back on my feet. Now I'm employed, renting a house, and back in the game. But I had a strong kundalini experience prior to moving back, and it took me a while to digest that it was only a preview, a glimpse, a fleeting glance at what was to come.
I've had to focus on stage 2, which is survival in the world. A child needs to be taken care of; an adult can take care of himself/herself. Not that any adult is truly independent in the sense of being absolutely self-sufficient. We all depend on each other for survival. The architect needs the builder to implement the design; the builder needs the manufacturer to procure the material; the manufacturer needs the Earth for its natural resources, etc. It's all interdependence. A cycle of exchange.
Still, something in me realizes that I must carve out my niche and fulfill a larger need in society. People are valued for what they can contribute, not for what they can take away. Although lately, it seems that the value has been switched to how much you can take away, and hoard, and accumulate--which explains a lot of the trouble. We idolize people that suck and drain the system for their own personal wealth. Kind of backwards.
But I digress. Going back to breaking free from the family, it's a process of entering the world to start a new family (continuing the old family) and the only way to do that (with health, functionality, prosperity, serenity, etc.) is to find what is actually of use to the broader life-system as a whole. I think once that occurs, then we can bask in the more refined air of enlightenment, high on the mountainpeak of fullness and achievement.
So, I've had to remember, that to win the prize, I have to be willing to run the race. God has designed the whole trip in a certain sequence for reasons beyond my comprehension, undoubtedly. But I think we can safely assume that evolution is real, and that we are becoming more God-like in our character as we ascend to Paradise.
Hope this helps. |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Feb 16 2014 : 11:55:06 PM
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Thank you Kami for this very insightful response. Very lucky to have you sharing your wisdom with me. I laughed when you mentioned your husband saying all that stuff. Interesting to see such a progression that he now is inspired to have what you have, and this I really hope will be the case for me and my family.
It is one of my goals to go to a retreat, but at the moment I don't have much of the funds necessary to travel and make these trips, even though I really would love too. I guess when the time is right. And solitude is possible, although not routinely. I have a large family, so people are constantly coming and going in this little town home, and it's easy to be disturbed or distracted, so I find myself sometimes waiting for moments when no one is home. I should probably start setting a time to be in solitude, as I pretty much just go to meditate whenever I feel the urge to do so.
I have tried talking to my family about why this is important to me, specifically because I want That just as much for them as I do for me. But their understanding is limited to their own conditioned beliefs, and most of them are not willing to suspend their beliefs so quickly in favor of clear point of view. So to them, it doesn't really seem like I'm doing something good because I'm not doing it the way they were told it's meant to be done. Ya know? They don't take me seriously basically.
Kami, that last paragraph makes a ton of sense intuitively and I want to thank you for it. When I really think about it, you're right, my reactions are coming from the way I perceive myself at the moment or want to be perceived. In a sense, I want to prove myself. But in reality, there is nothing to prove. It's only my mind trying to create and attach to an image, a solid idea of who and what I should be. Thank you so much for your post Kami. Always beautiful and inspiring.
Bodhi, bro, I had to really feel into your response to get the intuitive message behind it, as my mind was having a little bit of trouble understanding what you meant. But now I think I see it, feel free to fill in any gaps in my understanding.
Self-sufficiency, service, interdependence. I can see how they are related. We have to be self-sufficient in the world to realize where our strengths and talents lie, to be able to be of service. Without being self-sufficient, we cannot be of service if we completely depend on the service of others. That's where the constant taking comes in. But, also to be self-sufficient, we have to work with the whole, the bigger self. Interdependence. Am I going down the right alley here?
So I can sort of grasp that you're saying there is a necessary sequence going on here, one that requires cooperation and patience, and that by working with it, and the means that I've been given, the necessary steps that need to be taken and in the right direction will fall in place... Yes? Hopefully I'm not too far off here. Can you also explain this progressions relation to kundalini? Very interested to hear what you mean by that.
Btw, how is San Francisco? I kind of want to go to school out there, or San Diego maybe. Anywhere in California is looking like a fine place to be.
I did have a very interesting revelation yesterday involving my first post. Even though I have this strong desire to be around conscious and evolved people, it's not always about who gets it or not. The fact is, this body mind is on to something here, and that something has to be shared, with everyone, regardless if they understand it or not. And that's part of the journey, and part of the challenge.
Thank you both,
Much love |
Edited by - Chaz on Feb 16 2014 11:58:25 PM |
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts |
Posted - Feb 18 2014 : 11:35:45 AM
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I think you've got it. I think you're on the right track. I was just relaying what's worked for me in similar circumstances (family tension). Branching out beyond my comfort zone has helped.
Kundalini comes in waves. I knock on the door, constantly, but who is behind the door opening it? Not me. Some hidden, mysterious power beyond my control. But I don't stop seeking, cultivating, attuning myself to that mystery. Demanding, begging, searching--with various shades of hatred, love, and everything in between.
It's like a tiger that pounces on its prey and sinks teeth and claws into the flesh, gnawing until it gets down the bone, and even then, the bone's not deep enough. Must go deeper.
But--we can't plunge inward all the time, can we? So we must turn outward to the world and be amongst the other heathens that are wandering in the global tribe of misfits...fighting for survival and trying to find some kind of meaning in this charade.
Sorry, went off a mini-tangent there. 
Yes, San Francisco is golden. I met some fabulous people there, and that's where my spiritual path was really set ablaze...hanging out with mystic rascals and delinquent bodhisattvas. 
Godspeed!! !! |
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jonesboy
USA
594 Posts |
Posted - Feb 18 2014 : 1:01:06 PM
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Hi Chaz,
I get the same thing from my family and friends. They all know I do Yoga but we don't talk about it. Just last night my wife was complaining that my sessions take an hour. They don't but even if they did what does it matter?
I think Michael Brown has it right on this. It is not them that is hurting us. It is what they are saying that makes us feel a certain way that we don't like. It is hard, but I like last night. I try to dismiss my wife from the emotion and recognize that she is setting me up. Setting me up to feel.
I am being setup to feel those things that I have an emotional attachment to. Good or bad.
While the lessons may not be fun, those little moments are the times to practice, to learn and to grow.
I have also learned not everyone is ready to hear this. To do this.
So the best way is to do it by example. By showing how over time nothing will bother you. Your day's will be happier and your hurts shorter.
We also have to recognize that the passion we have for them to experience and to understand what we are doing. Is the same passion we must give them in not judging, accepting them for where they are on their path.
I hope that helps, |
Edited by - jonesboy on Feb 18 2014 5:46:52 PM |
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Holy
796 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2014 : 6:41:36 PM
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Hi Chaz,
I totally feel with you aswell! :) The good news is, this changes after some years. Yes it is also perhaps the bad news, but this strange karmic mixture in your family will smooth out erlier or later if you remain brave with the pratices. The best is, if you can to have the first practice after getting up. And by getting up a little earlier, you will avoid most of the conflicts with anyone else living in that house.
A trick is also to practice while still in lying position. It is not the best, but can make it more easy for you, especially if as you say other family members are present and have to sleep in your room.
And Bodhi is right, at some point one needs to learn to stand on his her own feet (something that has to fully happen here still aswell). A good first step is to start with a side job. It may be easy enough to do without much time effort and still bring in some cash that for sure will change the relationship of your family towards you. It is easy to joke with someone who can only rest in bliss, but if that someone also does all the other things in life, then we are speaking of a wonder here. How many can prepare food, clean the dishes and be in bliss at the same time? ;) How many can work the whole day in nondual joy. Obviously what we are trying to do is harder, but is it worth the effort? For this to find out it is always good to have PROPER inspiration by seeing accomplished bliss gods living daily life !! :) Watching them in youtube may also help (did here a lot too ;)
Friend, no worry, reading your honest post, I'd say, come here and enjoy life till you feel good enough to go your route, but obviously we live quite some distance away :D Therefor here the digital motivating PUSH for you: forget the BLABLA of your family, bomb the practices and go out of house, walk in nature and meet friends you like. Ask people what kind of work they are doing, how it affects their lifes, if they are happy with it. Just getting some feel what can be done and what not. You will see, a nice job will add tons to the effect of your daily practices. It needs not to be something full time, if your family accepts that, a transitory side job can bring you to your strength and clarity in life very nicely.
And then you can buy the females in your family some flowers and bring in some bread and fruits. That's when they will ly down to your feet and bath in your joy radiation ;)
Peace friend, we are standing behing you, do what you must do! |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Feb 27 2014 : 01:45:27 AM
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Bodhi, I always find your creative and abstract posts entertaining to read... so thanks for that. I definitely relate to and understand the whole kundalini thing. And man... San Francisco just gets more appealing hearing people talk about it. Hope one day I can live it large out there.
Jonesboy, I appreciate that reminder. It is very difficult sometimes when we've basically grown up being victims to what or whomever, that realizing we are actually only the victims of our own mental and emotional projections is often hard to digest... and yet it simultaneously makes sense.
quote:
We also have to recognize that the passion we have for them to experience and to understand what we are doing. Is the same passion we must give them in not judging, accepting them for where they are on their path.
Absolutely... I can vibe with that. 
Holy, thanks for sharing your post. Great advice. I needed to hear a lot of that.
I do have my own room so that isn't the issue, I just live in a small town home with quite a few people so my room is not really enough solitude for me sometimes. I don't have a lock on my door or anything like that, complete privacy is a little bit of a rarity over here.
I am living life and in bliss to various degrees moment to moment... I'm just not doing what they expect me to and on their time, and that's where the conflict arises. Not to mention they just don't understand what meditation/yoga is all about and I get frustrated with the lack of even TRYING to understand. It's one thing to not know, it's another thing to not know and make uneducated and completely immature comments without even trying to understand. That is why I get frustrated. I can say out of everyone though, since I had my recent kundalini experience, one person who is starting to understand and is being more open and patient towards me is my mother. That is big for me!
She reminded me yesterday in response to a comment my sister made to completely disregard the negativity. When people are doing good for themselves sometimes others like to discourage them for whatever reason... not that at this point that is even possible lolol. But, she reminded me to stay focused on myself and what I need. When I'm getting high using substances, I get crap for it, if I'm getting high on my own spirituality and trying to move in a progressive direction, I still get crap for it. She's right about that one. Some people will only see it their way sometimes and will only seek to validate what they believe and perceive. So I'm over that sh*t, I don't need their approval or support. Either way, with or without it, I get to bask in the love and bliss of God.
Thank you all,
Chaz |
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Jack
United Kingdom
305 Posts |
Posted - Feb 28 2014 : 04:37:27 AM
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Hi Chaz,
I sense their attitude is partly in regards to your level of daily involvement with the family.. I feel perhaps there is a money issue at play. Do they pay your way? How old are you? Do you contribute financially to the family or home while you are living there? Do they see any sign of you moving on in your life in a grounded, active way, or do they see you as 'wasting time'? What do you do each day? Do you work, or study, or are you unemployed?
Wishing you well, bro. Meditation puts us in a very aware, introspective and sensitive state. I remember sitting for 2 hours a day when I was 17-22, I was on a completely different wavelength to my family and their is the potential to start seeing everything they do as automatic, base, and unaware.
Anyway you sound like an intelligent and aware man, I wish you all the best. Generally getting some physical space might be a good idea, I know it helped my relationship with my family hugely.
Peace
Jack |
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Chaz
USA
129 Posts |
Posted - Feb 28 2014 : 12:18:16 PM
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Hi Jack,
Nobody pays my whole way, I am supported by my mother. That means the general bills for necessities that we all need, groceries, things like that... And frankly, to be quite honest, she's also paying for my older siblings to various degrees... Cell phone bills, medical insurance, loaning money when they are late in payments, etc etc. These are grown people, over 25. I'm still 19... See why it's frustrating? I am still learning and growing. It's overwhelming enough, I don't need the constant criticism from people who've been in my same position before. It's like the pot calling the kettle black. It's easy to criticize and forget that you had to go through similar trials and error. Not to mention the means they had are not the same means I have. It's easy to say "get your sh*t together" and forget about your own sh*t that needs to be taken care of. It's easy to say "you're going down the wrong path" when you don't even know what my path is... But because I'm young, I'm learning, I make mistakes, and I'm not living to your expectation... it's wrong. It's easy to look outward and judge but how many look within at themselves? I look within all the time, I scrutinize myself by nature, I really don't need others doing it.
I've had a few jobs before... I've had ways of getting money to help support myself and lessen the load on my mother. When my last phone broke I was the one who brought a brand new iPhone with insurance... Granted my mom is paying the family plan bill but we're working it out, once I am able to do so I will start paying for my line as well. I am grateful for her help even though it's so often thrown in my face. But it's not like I am a needy child who demands to be tended to and taken care of, I am a young adult finding his place in life and trying to acquire the means to be fully independent. For some it's easier than others... But I am trying. I wish I could snap my fingers and it would all fall into place. I've been applying to jobs (I am unemployed now). Matter of fact I just received an email from Target... They turned down my application. It isn't always an easy process. I graduated High School after a very rocky period in my life and that has reflected in grades, so I knew I wanted a break from that stressful environment. My gpa is not particularly helpful now that I do desire to pursue a higher education. So I have a few set backs and that's rarely understood and more often criticized.
I'll give my family a break. They have good intentions I guess, it's not so much that I'm wasting time to them, it's more that they think I'm fully capable and full of potential... They think I'm wasting my potential. I know that with God that is impossible, hence why my priorities lay there first. But they don't think like that, and yes they are very caught up in their dream lives and it's easy for me to see it, and I get upset with that as well because it pulls me in at times and it's very disorienting. Like I said, they only like to see from their limited perspectives a lot of the time. I've come to realize that space IS necessary at this point and I need to figure out the means to get it as soon as possible. There is a lot of negativity in the household at times and I just can't continue to be around all this toxic drama when my mind and body is purifying at the rate it is... It's just too much for me right now.
And for the record, I don't even do extremely long and unbalanced meditation sessions to have earned the meditation jokes... At this point for me, that would be a recipe for overload anyhow. I still do normal things people my age like to do; go out, see the world, hang out with friends, party, dance, am trying to add work and school in the mix, and just trying to live as fully as possible... They just don't understand what the meditation is all about, so they resort to jokes because they understand humor. Well, sometimes anyways. If it were more tasteful and had more truth to it I'd be laughing with them.
Because they won't accept what IS when it comes to me and my life, they are creating conflict out of that. They don't realize everything, same for them, has a time and place and as Bodhi said a natural sequence of events. And everyone walks a different path, mines is a little less conventional and clear to them. I just have to continue to do what I can, be patient and trusting in The Lord, as well as accepting towards them... that's all that matters for me.
Much Love,
Chaz |
Edited by - Chaz on Feb 28 2014 12:48:49 PM |
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kensbikes100
USA
192 Posts |
Posted - Jun 29 2014 : 09:26:51 AM
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Chaz, this is not easy, and I echo Kami's comments on your openness and the courage to express yourself.
One part of the issue is spirituality and work, or dharma. Now I am not an expert on dharma, but I have worked for nearly 40 years within a selected field.
To get a job is one thing. To find your work is another. Do you know what you want to accomplish in life? When you reach what is now known as retirement age, what do you want to have influenced in the world? And what then?
Can you use the spiritual path to achieve those goals, or to see well enough to see a path? Or at least to form a sincere vision of what you would like to be, based on your own values and abilities? A vision often creates its own path. It certainly represents a type of bhakti.
And if you choose engineering or other work in industry, keep in mind that it's not all mechanization and automation. Decisions are now very complex and require input, knowledge, and opinions from a lot of practitioners, and if you can "be the glue" with the ability to listen, understand, and make arguments to communicate your position to others. To see how to get decisions made is very important, and to do the work of speaking to all the people who are involved is one of the "hidden arts" of modern industry.
For me it was based on academics, and it ended up being focused on math and science, heavily influenced by my language skills. For >30 years I have worked as a systems engineer, using language to communicate to groups of designers what must be designed and what it must be designed to do. Now that I have started meditation and asana again, I see these disciplines could have helped me many years ago.
I think I'm quoting Buddha, but I'm not sure: "Before enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood, carry water." So work is a given regardless of spirituality. Maybe the right approach is to have spirituality with your work, and to have work that you can be proud of.
I've also discovered there is good work and bad work. In engineering for example there is expending the creative energies of a great team of geniuses on weapons, versus perhaps creating ways for cars to never accelerate out of control and to minimize damage to the world. I did the former, now I do the two latter.
Or is your value system to keep safe the freedom to choose spirituality versus ... being forced into a job? That would be another group of career paths. Or to help individuals, or perhaps to help others learn what you know.
Your mom is worried that you will not find a path, and a sign of this is not taking a job. Does it ever happen? Yes, to a lifelong friend of mine who was the most spiritual and brilliant person I knew in my school days. But her concern is real, as you can see. It took me a long time, and I'm sure I drove them crazy. |
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Dogboy
USA
2201 Posts |
Posted - Jun 30 2014 : 2:29:06 PM
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I bow to you Ken, your perspective is gold!
You have a big heart Chaz! It will serve you well on the rest of your journey!
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